Adding an Industry to the Forums, Please

[Craig Tickel]

Will you please add chemical or process industries as a new forum. The appplicatons of lean and six sigma has some interesting twists due to the basic design of processes within the industry…. sometimes hard to “watch” when things only move through pipes and into enclosed vessels… sampling, measurement variation, monitoring process variables… lots of interesting opportunities.

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[Stan Mikel]

Interesting? These are the simplest of processes to run and improve. Maybe you want a forum especially for MBA students as well where we just can use buzz words and simple thoughts.

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[Craig Tickel]

wow… thanks for the welcome….. sorry I thought it was a suggestion box, not a post here to be bashed. Don’t know your background Stan, assume you are a quality professional as well. Wondered how you determined that chemical processes are the simpliest things to run and improve. What is your metric? You do use metrics, right?

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[Stan Mikel]

I like your avatar.

Just trying to stir up a spirited discussion.

No I am not a Quality Professional but I have built some of the best quality systems in existence. I am a change agent who gets results and can figure out any problem that does not violate physics.

I do use metrics, never found a chemical process I couldn’t dramatically improve.

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[Darth]

Craig, Stan is the Official Forum Basher and not to be trifled with. He is legit and one of the best.

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[Mike Carnell]

Do you think you can get those lips pressed any harder against Stan’s buttocks

(I got censored a couple years ago when I used butt so I changed to buttocks – it seemed to be a better alternative to butt – the “ock” puts it in a much different perspective)

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[Darth]

I would press closer but someone else is in the way…..old partner

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[Craig Tickel]

My goal in this suggestion is to get all of the black belts at my current company to join herein and then to attempt to get many of our customer’s black belts to also join. Measurement error is a major problem in the chemical industry…trucking companies are making a good profit hauling drums back in forth when the primary problems is inconsistent measurement methods for things as simple as moisture or ph!

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[Darth]

Sounds like an easy fix. Nobody has to join iSickSigma to accomplish that fix. Simple MSA efforts should do it….along with some substantial penalties and fines on the truckers.

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[Stan Mikel]

Easy problem to solve. Want some help?

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[MBBinWI]

@CraigTickel – You should take Stan up on his offer. Lot’s of recent experience in driving MSA’s in operations that are measuring those types of items.

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[Savage]

I could be mistaken, but I think Craig was simply requesting a new category to be added. I don’t think he was soliciting opinions on how easy problems are to solve in a particular industries. But it is good to know that there are other experts available to help.

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[Michael Cyger]

@ctickel Great suggestion and much appreciated. Also good to speak with you by telephone the other day.

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[Craig Tickel]

Thanks guy, but I am well versed in MSA. Stan, sure, you want to help. Use your change skills to get interest in all the P&G and Unilever locations that we serve so that we can do conduct a study about the amount of variation there is from lab to lab. We do work to minimize the variation between our own internal lab. But when the variation is between the supplier(us) and the customer not as easy to get their attention. They simply declare it bad and want to send it back. Penalties to the trucking firm… wow, how would you go about that??? They don’t measure anything….

Matt, good to see you on here. Nice to know that our experience in traveling to Europe makes it easier for you to see where I am going! Laugh!

It is interesting that the measurement bible for the chemical industry tends to be a manual published by the AOAC (American Organization of Analytical Chemists) which was first published in 1975. They could use some help on MSA techniques!

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[Craig Tickel]

I enjoyed the discussion with you, Michael.

Expect an article from me about C&E diagrams(one of the most misused tools in projects) and one on this MSA subject related to Chemicals/process industries.

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[Stan Mikel]

Hey Elmo, you worry me. I offered to help you, didn’t ask you to name drop as an excuse to not solve a problem.

For what it’s worth P&G and Unilever are hard to help as they think they are the definition of world class with their variants of TPM. They aren’t. To quote my old friend, Dr. Mikel, they don’t know what they don’t know. That is the problem to be solved. There are billions on the table between the two giants.

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[Craig Tickel]

Stan, would like to have your help. Where did I name drop? Just trying to say that I do understand MSA techniques. Trying to say, this is a CHANGE issue, not a lack of technical expertise. Sent a friend request to you. Let’s talk!

Please don’t hit me with “excuse for not soloing the problem” when you also state that getting P&G et.al to recognize the problem is difficult… Oh, then drop Dr. Harry’s name… come on, who’s name dropping.

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[Stan Mikel]

Who is Dr. Harry?

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[Darth]

Stan mentioned Dr. Mikel not Dr. Harry. Here is the link to the Dr. Mikel he was referring to.

http://drlynnmikel.com/

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[Stan Mikel]

Hey, we are supposed to leave my fantasy wife out of this.

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[Craig Tickel]

Thanks for the reference, Darth. Do not know of her. Will learn more about her. Sorry for the assumption, Stan!

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[Darth]

Stan, Carnell and I are at the Detox session now with her so I will give her your email address to contact for further info. Stan, you and Carnell already have the perfect wives so no fantasies needed…..yes this was a paid announcement.

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[Craig Tickel]

Look forward to the contact!…. always willing to learn more from a resource that you guys recommend! and Stan, I have a nice wife already, so no worries about me intruding on your fantasy.

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[Anonymous]

I support this idea and would like to see more articles on this topic.

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[Mike Carnell]

Anonymous – articles on fantasy wives?

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[Darth]

I published a few of those on another site but FM and KB won’t let me provide a link.

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[Chantel Kamm]

I agree that there should be a Forum in Industries for Process or for Chemical. Some of the information is elswhere on the site, but it is scattered. Would like to discuss some topics that are specific to the Process Industry with others in the same industry.

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[Craig Tickel]

@Stanmikel

Chantel( @ckamm) works at stepan, where I also work…. She is an analytical chemist by education, but has been active in reducing measurement error at Stepan.
I would like to use Isixsigma as a discussion forum so that NOT only Stepan people can come to deal with some of the “challenges” we are facing regarding measurement error (and other topics) but others can participate as well.. especially people like you, Stan! It will need to be a legit discussion and have some topical structure in place. I hope to get at least 40 some people from Stepan to come here and hopefully to encourage others from the Chemical industry to join in as well.

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[MBBinWI]

@ctickel – despite some of the tangents you see here, when there is an actual and serious topic, you will find some decent responses (and then usually another wild tangent – but as you have noticed, sometimes they are rather entertaining). Please have your colleagues join and post their queries. Only caution is that they should come with a specific question, and have done their own due diligence (researched and tried the standard approaches). If they are still having questions, they’ll get some reasonable guidance here.

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[Pete]

Craig – Good to see you (virtually) again. Mike – Lets get back on the road! – Darth – I should have not given up so easily when I was trying to throw you in the trunk at TRW.
I was going to add to this post, but there are so many tangents and tangents frustrate me.

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[Stan Mikel]

@ctickel Chantel okay with you speaking for her? Doesn’t seem to set up a lively legit discussion if you answer a question I asked her. Or are you one of those kind of bosses?

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[Craig Tickel]

@stanMikel – my response wasn’t an answer for Chantel, just a restatement of my personal desires and a quick introduction of Chantel as a colleague. I am trying to get a forum for a serious discussion going somewhere here on isixsigma regarding measurement variation in the chemical industry. And again it isn’t a technical how to discussion, but rather a desire to get some results by getting some common approach on a number of issues.

@MBBinWI – thanks for the comment. I enjoy to quips and the fun here as much as the next guy and so I can take it and will hand it out in return. But I do want to get a serious thread going and to increase the number of people on here commenting and sharing their experiences in regards to those issues. Not having much luck yet. Feel like we need that forum structure to get people attracted and to participate. Open to suggestions to get the serious side started and rolling. Chantel will get a great representative for Stepan. I will be returning to the “road” in May.

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[Stan Mikel]

Craig, read your response. You did answer for her. A little introspection may be in order here if you don’t think you did.

And again Measurement variation in the chemical industry isn’t anything special. You keep talking about wanting to talk about it – talk about it with some substance already.

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[Peter Tibbetts]

@ctickel Craig – I know it is challenging, but if I recommend this forum to anyone I always provide with a disclaimer or warning. There are some nuggets of knowledge but often you have to sift through (ignore) the assaults (too strong?) and illusion of knowledge to discover those nuggets. Thick skin is a great quality for these threads.
I agree that you did NOT answer for Chantel. If you had, you would have began your sentence with “she” rather than “I”. Stan – perhaps a date with Grammar Girl is in order?

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[Stan Mikel]

Mr. Tibbetts, I did not ask Craig what he wanted to talk about. He has told us multiple times he want to talk but keeps on talking about wanting to talk. Pretty boring.

I thought Chantel might actually queue up a subject, but Craig just reiterated he want to talk but he just keeps talking about wanting to talk. Pretty boring.

I have to assume at this point he has nothing of substance.

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[Stan Mikel]

Craig and Peter – I am a big fan of Jim Rome and believe as he does if you don’t have a strong take on something, you shouldn’t say anything.

Both of you have pretty weak takes. Craig just talks about talking and Peter want to debate if Craig is talking for his colleague.

Who cares that they work at the same place? Tell what you want to talk about – that was the question I asked.

Want to talk about measurement? Great.

Want to pretend there is something unique about the chemical industry vs measuring thin films or cookies? Cool, but be prepared for a challenge. In the meantime you’ll actually get discussion if you actually put a topic out there.

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[Pete]

I lost my respect for Jim Rome, when a knowledgeable and articulate teenager called in and offered an opposing argument to Rome, and Rome’s only response was that kids should not be calling his show. I am also not a fan of people who bastardize the English language, but Rome attacks those people as if they are the source of his holier than thou approach to interviewing.
Stan – We are in agreement, that this is the 38th post in the thread, and I still not clear about what the challenges are in the chemical industry….

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[Craig Tickel]

@stanmikel

I am still waiting on the site to set a forum place to do the discussion. Don’t want, have no interest in starting in this thread.

@Peter Tibbetts

Thanks for the guidance and the support. Agree with the grammar analysis. Chantel will reappear here, and then she can speak for herself. Sorry if I was redundant… sorry if I was redundant…. sorry if I was redundant.

I want someplace to discuss the issue that will be easy to find…. not some discussion under suggestion box.

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[Peter Tibbetts]

Yeah, after I posted, I realized that was the whole point of your post. You were seeking another industry forum, rather than discussion on this thread.

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[Darth]

Hey Craig…how about suggesting another website that is less combative and argumentative?

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[Peter Tibbetts]

I kinda dig that part. It exposes posers.

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[Stan Mikel]

Craig, did anyone suggest that you start it as part of this thread?

You might want to look at the popularity of those specific forums, you shared wisdom won’t get much play. There is one already that would be appropriate for you discussion, it’s called methodology.

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[Stevo]

Gotta jump in. If you guys and whom ever is speaking for Chantel these days want me to start a general discussion for Chemistry MSA, I will. I’m sure there is someone cooking meth that would greatly appreciate it (BBinWI I’m looking at you.

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[Stan Mikel]

@Stevo While I agree with your point, and I think Fake Mike should add another industry forum under the name Redneck Entrepreneurs, I have to defend MBBinWI. These particular folks stay up late at night and so we should be looking for people who have had a habit of posting during late hours. That’s not MBBinWI, although I think he/she could improve their processes.

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[Mike Carnell]

@stanmikel – Redneck entrepreneurs – that can be a scarey concept. It seems the previously mentioned Methamphetamine industry has a fair number of rednecks and for some reason mixing rednecks and chemistry – particularly that chemistry – is probably root cause for so many of those labs blowing up.

Something like “Hey Bubba I heard last time I was in jail that you should add more eather”

“Naw I don’t think so. I think it needs to be hotter.”

If you think I am kidding look at this link. First line – “the name ether covers a bunch of different crap……”
http://www.simple-ways-to-make-methamphetamine.com/ether.html

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[MBBinWI]

@stanmikel, @Mike-Carnell, @Darth – the Dr. Mikel comments either answer a lot of questions – or raise others (hmmmm…)

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[MBBinWI]

@stevo – takes more than that to tweak my nose.
@Mike-Carnell – the old moonshiners could put the Japanese to shame with process optimization. Now the meth cookers – they’re just good for new entries in the Darwin awards.

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