ASQ Black Belt Certification – Please Respond!

I have to agree with Randy.  There are Black Belt programs . . . Then there are Black Belt programs.  I know the Allied Signal, GE, Honeywell, and several others demand the tops in respect.  More importantly, the BBs come out of these “Six Sigma boot camps” very competent.
I have heard +’s and -‘s about ASQ’s program.  These days we occasionally get a MBB or BB grilling us to make sure we have the “real thing” and not a cheap quick accelerated imitation BB.  At the risk of sounding biased, I don’t think you can go wrong with the Allied or equivalent BB.  GE works for me too.  But the $2,995 2-weeker BB does not!
Terry 
 
 

Does anyone know the value of BB certification from the George Group?  Is it up there or not well thought of?
 
David

Certification in any field does not necessarily mean you are competent in that field. However, certification by a recognized body, e.g. ASQ, usually does mean two things: one, you are interested and dedicated enough to have put forth the effort to get the certification; and two, you have at least a certain minimum level of knowledge of the field.
Certifications should be taken for what they are worth. Being certified doesn’t automatically mean the person is expert in a given field. But to say that a certification from a recognized professional body is worthless is equally untrue.

Good discussions.  There are both brilliant leaders and idiots with Harvard MBA’s.  There are brilliant successful leaders from “nuts n’ bolts” universities without as much glamour.  There are both great BBs and primadonnas from GE, Allied, ASQ, XYZ Corp., and other less recognized programs.  Not picking on any organization in particular, just making a point.
My point – BB Certification is just the first baby step, not the ends.  Certification only “punches” your ticket.  Sure, you increase your odds by going through a well recognized program surrounded by brilliant peers.  But in the end, it depends on how you apply this new knowledge.  The leadership is within the person wearing the belt, not in their title or the belt itself.  If you make a personal commitment to live and breathe this stuff and become great at it, you will think a lot differently, learn to do the impossible in many situations, and achieve beyond your wildest dreams!  That’s what really matters.  Then it’s a lot easier to summarize these accomplishments on a resume. 
Terry

Chris Young, please contact me.  I am in search of a SS recruiter.  [email protected].
Hike

I have to agree that the certification is only as good as what you’ve done with it.  Certificiation is like graduating from high scholl, it’s only worth completing the basic step and it depends on what you do with it. 
 I like the idea of ASQ’s certification since we have a standard organization certifying your BASIC skills.  I liken it loosely to how ISO got started.  Standards were set that aren’t that hard to pass but at least everyone got on the same sheet of music.  Let’s face it, if you get 3-4 projects under your belt that produce big results, who cares how or where you got certified.  It’s pointless to argue hard results.

Chris,
I like to think of BB certification and a university education. If you were hiring a recent graduate into your business, would you rather hire a Yale/Harvard/Stanford/Berkeley graduate or one from you local community college? (Before everyone has a field day espousing how Einstein went to community college, etc., I would say that there are of course exceptions to every rule.) 9 times out of 10 I would say that those graduating from a more prestigious school are smarter, worked harder and are more ready to contribute to your business.
Should all costs be equal? Should you only have to pay the $5 per unit cost of your community college if you went to Yale? I think not. You work hard, pay your dues, take out loans, etc., because it is more prestigious. The same is true for BB certification.
I agree with your accreditation point, but Six Sigma doesn’t work that way and ASQ (seemingly the only body to do this accredidation) isn’t in a position now that they’re competing with everyone else to make a few bucks.
Just a few thoughts worth a few pennies. Does anyone else agree?
BBxs

I work for an international firm which deals with colleges and universities.  We only deal in those which are accredited schools so that we do not pass along to our audiences, poor examples in higher education.  This not only protects our good name but also protects the young high school graduate seeking a decent education in hopes of a good quality job when he/she graduates.
So, why not start asking from a ground swell movement on behalf of both the companies and the individual that we have this standardization and accreditation!  We should all strive for the best we can be with an equal regimen of training for an equal price.  And the companies who hire us will feel they are getting a worthwhile individual who has been trained well.  The only variable being that person’s prior experience.

Chris,
I tend to agree with BBxxs.  Being a Black Belt “certified” through my employer, in conjunction with a well respected group, I have a hard time believing that ASQ accrediation is any better that the education that I received.  I am certified as a CQA through ASQ and I have seen the exam given to applicants for the ASQ SSBB certification.  If the questions posed to the applicants are based upon the BOK the ASQ provides, then I believe that my training and project completion requirements provided a more thorough coverage of material.
In this month’s Quality Progress Issue, two individuals went through the ASQ SSBB certification process.  It was recommended in the article that individuals that have received certification from another body, take the ASQ certification test.  Is that “value added”?
I believe that there are +’s and -‘s associated with each SSBB program.  In order to become a better SSBB,  whether “certified” or not, is continually learning and applying the necessary hard and soft skills, project completion, and mentoring others (GB’s / BB’s).  You, and the entire organization will benefit as a result.
TC

TC:  Both you and BBx have made good points.  I agree.  Many thanks.  Chris

That is interesting discourse.
ASQ has a body of knowledge that is quite comprehensive. Is it exhaustive? No! But then who decides what should be in there ? Atleast ASQ has a process to come up with exam questions, BOK, grading standards that is based on a survey of a cross section of the professionals associated with Six Sigma.
To me, they are as acceptable to me as any other consulting agency/ company that pays attention to these things before they certify someone. 
What is a certification supposed to do?  Good question.
What is a degree supposed to do for that matter? It doesn’t say how many hours you studied before an exam, or how well you understood your stuff, compared to any other student. On top of that a certification doesn’t even come with any performance report.
These are all “lowest common denominator” type measures. If you are looking at folks who have excelled, look at the results of their work. Do not look at the piece of parchment that only talks about their competencies and not necessarily about their talents and mastery with the tools.
 Did I take ASQ certification? Yes. 
Do I think my resume speaks better about my abilities? You bet!
Best,
Sambuddha
 
 
 

Hi Mark, 
Was just speaking with a recruiter in the UK.  To him, the BB is like a brand to hiring firms.  They make no distinctions from whom you have recieved your training.  What is of vital interest to them is what you have done with it.  What returns have your accomplished for your company and how did you do it. 
Does ASQ need to be a governing body.  Well, a Black Belt to quality is not exactly what a CPA is to accounting.  I don’t think our pracitces will have an impact on companies like auditing as had on investing and the viablility of an enterprise.  A Black Belt could not be blamed for Enron. :) (Tounge and Cheek)
Get your certification from a company that has accomplished somthing – with trainers that are experienced implementors!   That is what is important in our field. You can  learn from their successes and failures.