iSixSigma

certification

Six Sigma – iSixSigma Forums Old Forums General certification

Viewing 28 posts - 1 through 28 (of 28 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #29466

    Dewayne
    Participant

    How do I obtain 6 sigma certification and blak belt certiification ithe shortest and most cost effective manner?
     

    0
    #75524

    Ann O. Nimoos
    Participant

    Open a powerpoint slide and create your own certificate!
    (just kidding)
    Seriously, you may consider finding work with a company that espouses ss.
    (Honeywell, GE, Motorola, etc…)
    it’s free and you’ll probably find a career-track in the firm.
    -Ann

    0
    #75525

    Dewayne
    Participant

    Thanks Ann,
    I was just laid off. Now I’m taking classes in Industrial Pharmceutical Engineering. Do you know of any pharmaceutical company that use 6 sigma or black belt in thier manufacturing processes?
    Thanks,
    Dewayne

    0
    #75547

    Jay Fleischmann
    Participant

    There is a quality group call IQF.  International Quality Federation.   They are certifying green, black and master black belts.  I recently passed the SSMBB exam and must say that the exam is quite intensive if you want it to be.  Also, it’s possible to pass the exam with mininal training.  It is taken online from your home or wherever and right not, only $100.
    Check out http://www.iqfnet.org
    Also, Visteon and SME have recently adopted this as their official certification exam; so it’s gaining credibility.
     

    0
    #75550

    Terese
    Member

    Jay, please…
    What is going on here? IQF? Who are they and where did they come from? Why would anyone place any value on a Black Belt certification from yet another quality association?
    I just visited their website and it looks like an amateur hack job. Is it trying to be a new and improved ASQ? I just don’t get it. Look at their website counter — it shows a total of 6,000 views…not one of the most frequently visited sites on the net.
    Also on their site is a link to their test featured in Quality Digest. Are the two organizations related? Is Quality Digest an owner of IQF (to try to compete with ASQ and Quality Progress? I don’t know the answers, but there are a lot of questions in my mind that are unanswered.
    I don’t know the exact value of ASQ certification, but it has to be worth more than IQF.

    0
    #75587

    Sinnicks
    Participant

    I have the same questions as Terese.    What is the value of ASQ certification?   Is it considered the same as a GE certification?

    0
    #75591

    Jay Fleischmann
    Participant

    Sheesh!  Is there really a need to be so frickin’ hostile??
    Yeah, it’s a startup organization.  As far as competing with ASQ, no, not at all. 
    It is by far the most practical exam I’ve taken.  The questions are purely quantitative.  No multiple choice here.  None. 
    If I had to choose between two job candidates, one who has IQF certification and one who has ASQ certification, I’d go with the IQF candidate every time.  To me, ASQ de-emphasizes problem solving and enforces Six Sigma nomenclature.  IQF is the exact opposite. 
    Are they credible?  Ask Visteon, Lear, and SME. 
     

    0
    #75593

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Jay,
    If you think Terese’s response was hostile you probably need to get a nice cup of herbal tea and head for your cubicle while you back out of any type of program that involves driving change. It isn’t called hostile it is called an opinion. You might come off a little more credible if you watched American Pie II after you answered things on the website rather than before.
    As far as passing a test to get certified, it is disrespectful to the people who have worked through a class and had to execute results under a time constraint regardless of who’s test it is.
     

    0
    #75624

    Jay Fleischmann
    Participant

    “It isn’t called hostile it is called an opinion. You might come off a little more credible if you watched American Pie II after you answered things on the website rather than before.”
    -What????

    As far as passing a test to get certified, it is disrespectful to the people who have worked through a class and had to execute results under a time constraint regardless of who’s test it is.”
    -Again, what?????

    0
    #75671

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Jay,
    I’m not really clear on what you don’t understand. Your response to Terese was why so hostile. She wasn’t hostile. She expressed an opinion. There shouldn’t be any issue with that since you obviously had no issue with expressing yours. She shouldn’t need to feel compelled to have her opinion validated by some company or organization. If we all take that attitude then we will end up never improving anything.
    If you can’t understand the American Pie II response try having an adult read your response to this string and the FMEA question. I really hope for your sake if you are trying to drive change in your organization which means you will have to communicate with adults they probably won’t relate to technical jargon like “Blammo”. If you represent a team and the work they have put into a project you will have to do a little better job of representing yourself as some one who has some credibility. You owe it to the team. You may find this cute but there are very few management teams that will.
    Good luck.

    0
    #75693

    Terese
    Member

    Mike,Thanks for your comments. I didn’t mean for my comments to be taken as hostile. There a just a good deal of question and it doesn’t appear as if Jay is being forthcoming with all of the information he knows. It didn’t appear to be generating good dialogue and my answers weren’t being answered (that I posed), so I decided that my comments on this thread was futile.I do appreciate your attitude in sharing information. I wish we could all do more of that. Anyway, thanks again.Therese

    0
    #75697

    Chris Young
    Participant

    Terese,
    Mike, as always, makes an excellent point.  Pay attention here, Jay.  As an executive recruiter who specializes in placing Six Sigma, Lean, and Quality professionals, it is not the certification that makes someone a desirous candidate.
    Certifications come and go, and for the most part, are only as valuable as the successful track record of the organization by which they are given.  Truly, it is a combination of technical merit, communication skills, leadership ability (including the ability to get the buy-in/ influence skills), and practical application experience (Hands-on project work in process re-engineering and applying the Six Sigma methodology to positively impact an organization’s bottom line… or the mentoring of such projects for you MBB’s).  These are the qualifications that companies should be looking for in their Six Sigma professionals. 
    Without these essentials, your certification isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on…
     

    0
    #75699

    melvin
    Participant

    Jay:
    You wrote:
    “I recently passed the SSMBB exam and must say that the exam is quite intensive if you want it to be.  Also, it’s possible to pass the exam with mininal training.”
    A) I don’t understand what you mean by “if you want it to be” – it either is intensive or it isn’t intensive based on your ability unless you have an option to choose the primary school version or the phD version.
    B) If it’s possible to pass the exam with minimal training, then that means practically anyone can pass it, which means that practically anyone can be a MBB through these folks.
    I agree with Chris – unless you have a proven track record, the certificate (whoever it is from) is just a bunch of hooey.
     
     

    0
    #75716

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Terese,
    I agree that your comments were not hostile. They are your opinion and lack of cosistency with Jay doesn’t make them hostile. Jay doesn’t seem to think so and fired off one of his “Ernest does Six Sigma” messages.
    I would think that at the very least your impression of the website would be a valuable piece of data for whatever organization put the site together.

    0
    #75718

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Chris,
    Thanks.
    I am not sure if it is a function of the poor market conditions or the multitude of people printing off their own certifications (hence this new self agrandizing level of Gran Master Black Belt) but the people searching for BB’s and MBB’s have definately become more discrimination with regards to style and substance. Dragging around your 2 inch file of degrees and certifications (or wearing a name badge with 10 different color ribbons memorializing you career) doesn’t seem to get the job done anymore.
    Thanks.

    0
    #75719

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Bob,
    True Six Sigma analysis. You left out the emotion and analyzed the message. Nice job.
    Thanks.

    0
    #75720

    Ex MBB
    Participant

    Chris, Mike, and “Gang”:
    I urge caution is the advice that you are providing… I fully buy your comments about certifications.  Certifications alone do not imply demonstrated competence and proficiency.  However, quite a few organizations utilize certifications as a first pass filter in their recruiting and selection process.  In fact, most organizations recruiting Six Sigma personnel mandate certification. If you dismiss certification, you could be dismissing future career opportunities. 
    So, I would recommend certification be the means of receiving professional recognition, and understand that competence and confidence comes from understanding and applying the discipline and/or methodology. 

    0
    #75722

    Chris Young
    Participant

    Dear ex-MBB,
    I understand your concern…and, believe it or not, I agree with some of your ideas.  In-house recruiters often lack the experience of working hand in hand with many different organizations.  Therefore, they are not exposed to the fact that each company takes Six Sigma to a different level.  They use “certifications” as a pre-qualifier in their recruitment of such roles. 
    Thus, you can see why I become so frustrated with this grand certification process.  I may have a MBB that is the ideal fit for the company’s needs and a perfect match for their corporate culture, but if they lack a certification, they are passed-up for a lesser candidate who has said certification.  I would even go as far as saying that a BB in one company may be more than qualified to fill a MBB role in another organization…but again, certifications and titles bar the way. 
    Perhaps if certifications were standardized, or even eliminated, they would need to judge on a candidate’s merits rather than their paper trail…

    0
    #75723

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Ex,Nobody is discounting certification. It takes more than certification to get in the door. It isn’t anything more than a memebership card in this market. you had better be able to back it up with a track record, which I believe was the message Chris delivered.Part of the issue when you look at the “test for certification” scenario is that the application is contingent on the ethics of the person doing the submission. I will guarantee that a person who has been through a certification process with a MBB such as a Ray Everhart or Linus Kelly has worked their butt off to get certified and the results do not have any soft savings attached. The other aspect is certifying someone in an organization that doesn’t have a SS deployment in progress is cutting a large part of the process short. Understanding the company infrastructure, project selection process, etc. isn’t there. It is as important to the process as understanding which hypothesis test is necessary.

    0
    #75724

    husker
    Participant

    Regarding Certification
    I am currently a Quality Engineer for a medical products company.  We have a six sigma Black Belt training program with the Juran Intitute. 
    I am working on my certification project  ( We need to complete and submit 2 projects for certification).  You must demonstrate you can use and apply the tools.  We also had a 4 week training DMAIC thing.
    Only about 15% – 20% of the people who did the 4 week training go on and get the certification.    The certification is not easy.  Both of your projects must be high $ value and successful.   
    If I were looking for a Certified BB,  I would look for     1. The 4 week training     2.  At least 2 completed projects.
    The people that go on and do the work for the certification are the people you want in your organization!
     

    0
    #75728

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Husker,
    I think that was really our point. The idea of SS certification has never been speading around another piece of paper that people can frame and hang on their ego wall or add another line of trivia to their business card. It is about identification of people who can be “impact” players in an organization.
    Thanks.

    0
    #75729

    Ex MBB
    Participant

    I definitely share your frustration about certification.  Here is a little background to support my first posting:
    I have interviewed many BB and MBBs that have “a” certification and was woefully disappointed.  In fact, I issued marching orders to the recruiters that they need not bother sending candidates from certain programs/companies based on this.  Their program did not ensure that the certified individuals had the ability to use the needed skillsets/tools.
    Unfortunately, this certification requirement IS the initial hurdle.  If that is lacking, chances are, a candidate will not even progress to the phone screening.  I get the resumes see what program and certifying authority issued the certification.  I also look at their project portfolio: type of projects, results, number of projects, training experience, mentoring (if MBB), and the like.  I also balance their salary requirements with my salary range.  I do read cover letters! 
    If that looks good, I then schedule a phone interview.
    The phone screening is where I get the first snapshot into competence and proficiency.  I have certain requirements for the positions, and this is where I get the sense of whether the certification is just paper, or if there is substance supporting it. I also drill deeper into the project portfolio.  Oh, there are also the canned questions (like why are you leaving or have an interest in leaving your current employer).
    If that goes well, they are then asked to visit for interviews where they will chat with me (again), peers, and the functional management that they will support.  This gives me another snapshot into competence and proficiency, as well as how well they will fit with the organization.
    However, the a near-certain show-stopper for this whole process is a lack of certification, and that is why I urged caution in the first posting. But I do not rely just on the certification. I have confidence in the selection process to see sort through any fluff.
    I think Mike, Chris, and I are stressing the same things…
     

    0
    #75765

    G
    Participant

    Hi Dwayne,
    Did any of this help?
     
     

    0
    #75778

    SSS
    Member

    I do not beleive the criteria of getting a SS certification should be high value project instead should be on % savings . I am surprised if Juran Institute rates a project and certification based on value of the project. the project should be the base to show that the principles of SS are understood . I say this because each of the topic in Six Sigma requres an indepth study and are subjects by itself. I dont think a 4 week course is enough to really understand. It merely give a direction .

    0
    #75781

    husker
    Participant

    I didn’t mean that Juran requires high $ savings.  Yes the % improvement is part of any project.
    Yes Juran makes sure the BB candidate has a knowledge of the tools and how you applied them in your project.
    I get to work on my certification project all Memorial day weeked so I can meet the deadline.   Yipeee!!!!
     

    0
    #75783

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    SSSS,
    If you are out there working on a project that doesn’t have some form of financial reward for it then you are probably working on the wrong thing. This is as basic to the SS methodology as any of the tools.

    0
    #75793

    SSS
    Member

    Dear Mike
    I think you r right that it should have a financial reward. What I mean is a financial reward can be shown as a big value but its impact in terms of percent can be small. If you see the Afadavit for ASQ it says the project to be SIGNIFICANT . which I beleive is the key .
     

    0
    #76030

    Michael Ervick
    Participant

    Wow, this thread was interesting.  This is one of the few place that I can actually find fibers of integrity in the exchanges of ideas.  I am sure there are many of you who are just like me in terms of passing the 20 year mark in the trenches of quality and process. 
    I know there are thousands of quality professionals with decades of experence in process improvement.  Professionals certified in QC, SPC, TQM, ABC, BPR, CMM, etc, etc, etc.  Today all of these certifications have faded from our radar screens.  Are they no longer valued?  Will the SS certifications fade in the next 3 to 5 years?  Will we need to invent a new certification? 
    From my perspective, until these certifications evolve into a broader profession based certification as opposed to a program based certification, they will all continue to rise and fall over time.  
     

    0
Viewing 28 posts - 1 through 28 (of 28 total)

The forum ‘General’ is closed to new topics and replies.