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Fraud

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  • #147192

    Lebowski
    Participant

    I am not aware of Harry having a monument which makes urinating on it a physical impossibility. I am sure when Reigle reads your post he will become cognizant that he has neglected to get Harry a monument and will scurry around finding one. I am sure in keeping with the Harry tradition he will only be content to have a monument that was erected to someone else and he will claim it for himself. Why change MO now?
    Before we move to contribution we need to address the issue of peer reviewed articles. That issue was brought up by Correction. I never claimed to have written any peer reviewed articles. According to Correction neither has Harry. Correction appears to be very fastidious so I tend to believe him/her. That makes your issue around peer reviewed articles mute. It also is a poor reflection of your reading retention. Two words for you. Evelyn Wood.
    About contribution. You seem to believe that any contribution is better than none. I question that. I brought up Ken Lay earlier. He contributed but I would decline any opportunity to contribute as he has. I think you logic leaves something to be desired here,
    Now lets assume that Harry has contributed in a positive way. You have made the assertion that to be considered a contributor I must do the same thing. That does not make any sense at all. That would mean to be a contributor we would all have to be Harry clones and do exactly as Harry does. That would absolutely delight Harry. Reigle might be able to rest better knowing we were all behaving better and he would no longer need to scold people on this site for misbehaving. It would really truncate contribution as a whole. There would be no more contributions in pharmaceuticals, no new designs for cars, fashion would stagnate, etc unless of course Harry chose to do that then every contributor in the world would have to do that. There is no credibility here.
    Contribution is measured individually. I do not want to contribute as Ken Lay, Pastor Haggard, Jimmy Swaggart, Michael Miliken, and hundreds like them have contributed. Just doing something does not make it a positive contribution.
    Spud my boy quoting Stan “What nonsense.”
    Lebowski

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    #147193

    Sputnik
    Member

    Spudkowski,
    You have managed to write a superbe and extremely well-thought through post. Especially the “p” word adds to the intellectual maturity demonstrated by your post. … Your are right where you deserve to be :-).

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    #147194

    BB
    Participant

    “Six Sigma has never implicitly said we were trying to achieve target and the way we still teach SPC (yes even Wheeler) reflects that.”
    Stan, this is correct but in fact the situation is much worse.  Six Sigma is fundamentally a specification based methodology.  The very idea of 3.4 DEFECTS relates to the specification, not the target.
    Six Sigma has much nonsense; probably some fraud including the 15-20% sales loss at Cp=1.33 ; but worse of all, its fundamentals are wrong.  Good quality can only mean on target with minimum variance.

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    #147195

    Lebowski
    Participant

    I am glad to see you have chosen a higher road to travel these days.
    We are in complete agreement on Spud’s foolish post.
    Lebowski

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    #147197

    Lebowski
    Participant

    This really sounds good but I have a question.
    BB you stated: “Stan, this is correct but in fact the situation is much worse.  Six Sigma is fundamentally a specification based methodology.  The very idea of 3.4 DEFECTS relates to the specification, not the target.”
    Then you stated: “Good quality can only mean on target with minimum variance.”
    The two seem to be in conflict. If I define a target doesn’t that become a specification? How big was that minimum variance? Once I get a taget and a minimum variance defined that realy starts to look like a USL and a LSL. Where is that difference?
    Lebowski

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    #147199

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    I  don’t  believe  its an  invention of  Harry’s:(Historically,studies have shown  costs of  poor  quality to  run as  high as  15-40% of costs of  goods  sold or  about 15-20 percent of  sales revenue,an  axtra ordinary sum of  maney  sold??) Just  read this  paragraph from the Juran  Institute’s SS Breakthrough &  Beyond (2004)/Page 25.I  assume that 4Sigma-products can  cause 15-20% of sales  revenue.Again  it  is  not  pure  fraud??  

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    #147201

    Correction
    Participant

    Lebowski,
    The very nature of “blind belief” and “superstition” has always been to cater to the lowest of all human impulses. As a result, “Ecrasez l’infame” has always been responded to with venom, a lack of intellectual stringency and “ad hominem arguments”. These individuals may get a short-term relief through their “bashing” and “dishing out”. But they cannot undo the unpleasant little fact, that Harry did not publish his findings about six sigma in scientific journals but instead wrote op-eds in trade journals. This fact cannot be undone, no matter what my, your or even Harry’s academic credentials are :-). So let them suffocate in their own venom. We’ll stick with the facts. Have a great day!

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    #147204

    Spudbowski
    Member

    It would seem that not only logic but analogy escapes you.    Dr. Harry has, whether you recognize or appreciate it or not, furthered the field of Six Sigma.   You and other forum Harry Six Sigma coattail riders now completely disavow his contribution to publicizing (albeit via self-promotion) and making more of a corporate household name the concept of Six Sigma.
     
    I do repeat, what have you and your clever cohorts done in kind, your lack of intellectual contributions and peer reviewed journal citations notwithstanding?   
     
    It’s my belief that the shakers and movers in life are out there doing and others less qualified or accomplished are hiding behind the anonymity of arcane technical forums to take little potshots at the doers.      
     
    Face it, as painful as it might be, like him or not, Dr. Harry has become a very successful businessperson and you and your friends have not, plus you’re cowards, have limited and fragmented reasoning, and froth like sociopaths.  
     
    Dwight Matthew Spudbowski, III, PhD, MBB and All-Around Well-Reasoned Objective Thinker

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    #147205

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Thank you. Every day is a great day.
    I love to read the Discussion Forum because it is educational and entertaining. The thing that has amazed me about this string and has prompted me to get involved it that from a simple question you jumped in and turned up quite a bit of well documented issues on Harry. The people who supposedly know him have never chosen or thought to go to the basic issues around him. We have never seen Reigle break that facade of what he loves to call professionalism quite this quickly and so publicly. These thrashing are typically reserved for the catacombs under the Academy.
    Please don’t concern yourself with Reigle’s posts. I am sure he doesn’t actually write them. He isn’t that smart. He more of a Dom Delouise type character. Less likeable and smells like cigarettes. The great part is this string seems to have helped him find his counterpart in Marlon Brando. They can probably work something out so when Harry kicks Reigle he can probably kick Marlon Brando and they will all believe it is professional. Sort of a masochistic conga line. The new Tommy Bahama image will work well with this (the new fall line will feature black leather with embossed palm trees and lots of studs – I think I hear Joe BB wiggling around in his seat, it will probably take a fork lift to pry him off that chair).
    Very nice work. My compliments. You are definately a contender for the Woodward and Bernstein Award for the Discussion Forum. You may have a monument before Harry (watch Reigle hustle now).
    Lebowski

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    #147207

    got ya
    Participant

    I knew it.  Phil.  You rascal.

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    #147208

    BB
    Participant

    Lebowski,
    A simple example might help those new to SPC.
    My target is 10cm +/-0.02  giving specs of :
    USL = 10.02 cm
    LSL = 9.98 cm
    My process runs with a variance indicated by :
    UCL = 10.01 cm
    LCL = 9.99 cm
    Mean = 10.0 cm
    My process is on target.  Reducing variance will bring control limits closer to the mean.
     

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    #147209

    BB
    Participant

    Rather than appearing a fraudster like Harry, perhaps you can give us a link to these “studies” ????? 
    Your statement “4Sigma-products can  cause 15-20% of sales  revenue” is meaningless.  What are you trying to say ?

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    #147210

    Lebowski
    Participant

    You seem a little frustrated Spud. I think you have seen from you last post that the holes in your logic were recognized by more than just myself. It seems to have struck a nerve.
    Harry as a successful business person is an interesting concept. How have determined that? That was the story on Ken Lay and the boys until a couple years ago.
    Let’s test this: “Dwight Matthew Spudbowski, III, PhD, MBB and All-Around Well-Reasoned Objective Thinker” Your first post was posted as? (the answer is Spudbowski my god I can’t believe that is a real name) and then you posted “hiding behind the anonymity of arcane technical forums to take little potshots at the doers.” it is probably marginal because technically it is your name but who in the world would have believed that. It seems you chose to run the anonymity thing until you got kicked around for your Well-Rounded Objective Thinking.
    I am pulling out my copy of Helter Skelter and checking to see if I want to be a contributor like Charlie.
    Lebowski

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    #147211

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Phil? You sound like Eddie Murphy in Beverly Hills Cop.

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    #147212

    mand
    Member

    Yes, there’s lots of household names besides Mikel Harry and Charles Manson. Let’s see, there’s Skilling and Lay from Enron for starters

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    #147213

    Correction
    Participant

    Lebowski,
    It’s a pleasure meeting you. I like your dry sense of humor and your razor blade intellect. It’s quite refreshing :-). Have a great day!

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    #147214

    Spudbowski
    Member

    Nope.  Not frustrated at all.   You haven’t demonstrated other than your being a carper of others.   It might be impressive if you, as I suggested a posting or two earlier, rolled-out your own accomplishments so we could compare yours to Dr. Harry’s.
     
    A great many know his name but I’d be willing to bet you live in the disillusioned anonymity of more than just this forum.
     
    And yes, I do come from a long and proud line of Spudbowski’s, great intellects and warriors all.     
     

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    #147215

    Lebowski
    Participant

    That makes it much clearer. That 10 cm is a target not a specification? Exactly what is the difference between suggesting a taget (because we cannot specify it) and specifying a nominal value?
    Since I am running to Control Limits in your scenario and I have no specification limits how would I know that at say 10.03 my product no longer works since I never had that USL of 10.02 to let me know that there was a function issue beyond that number.
    Now if your contention is that I still have the specification limits but I am just not paying any attention to them because I focus on the taget and minimizing the variation (how big was minimum again? what if it was bigger than 0.02 in your example) in a Six Sigma world I would be trying to reach a standard deviation of 0.0033 (.04/12). We know there are not many operations that actually achieve that so how is it again that your proposed flaw in Six Sigma is going to change my life significantly?
    Lebowski

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    #147216

    B Westlake
    Participant

    I’m having a hard time trying to work out if this guy is:
    a) stupid
    b) a con man like Harry
    c) not a con man but stupidly conned by Harry

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    #147217

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Thanks for a couple great days of posts.
    They are all good. It is time to ride the bicycle and watch the sun set.
    Lebowski

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    #147218

    Stupid
    Member

    I addmit I am not veri clevr but wot r Harrys “accomplishments” ???????????

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    #147219

    B B
    Participant

    I think it might help if you repeated high school before anyone bothers answering this.

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    #147220

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Ooh! ooh! ooh! ooh! ask me! ask me! ask me! 
    The answer is A, wants to be B and probably a little of C.
    Covariates. You know like maturation except in this case it never happened.
    Lebowski

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    #147222

    Lebowski
    Participant

    That is funny.
    There probably carved into the monument Reigle will produce shortly.
    Lebowski

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    #147223

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Darth?

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    #147225

    Reality!
    Participant

    FACT:  One cannot speak of SPC without the mention of Shewhart, or TQM without mention of Deming, Crosby, Juran, and Feigenbaum, and most certainly, one cannot speak of Six Sigma without mention of Bob Galvin, Bill Smith, Mikel Harry, Larry Bossidy, and Jack Welch. It is what it is, like it or not, it is REALITY!
    Cheers! By Reality

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    #147226

    Darth
    Participant

    Sorry, I have been sitting this one out although I have been reading all the posts and enjoying the reparte.  Phil has been in rare form and his ramblings are easily recognizable.  I did a Google on the Spudman and came up empty.  Alas, maybe that isn’ t a real name afterall. 
    In my opinion and I have voiced it clearly in the past, Harry needs to be appreciated for creating an industry of SS consultants.  Whether it was snake oil or peer reviewed journals, the fact is that Bill Smith and Motorola would not have created the widespread recognition that SS enjoys today.  Putting aside the bull riding incident at the ASQ conference and all the other BS that has been associated with the Ranch and it’s inhabitants, he did create awareness and for that, I am appreciative of his efforts. 
    For fun, I did a Google on “Father of Six Sigma” with some interesting results.  Check it out.

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    #147227

    A Really PO’d Spudkowski!!
    Participant

    Actually Darth, since it’s you and you’re being all sincere and all – I thought I recognized my old buddy Phil and tried to pick a fight.   With all of the humor, logic and wherewithal aligning on the Harry bashing side, I was forced to align myself with Marlon Brando for a bit of Last Tango in Paris forum buttering and Phil bashing.   But he’s especially adept with truth and logic on his side.
     
    It’s tough to argue when you truly believe your story’s main protagonist (and I don’t mean Marlon) is fundamentally a hair-lipped dork – a wonderful self-promoter and in doing so a wonderful and accomplished promoter of Six Sigma’s 3.44 DPM paradigm, but essentially a HLD. 
     
    So….. I’m a bit ashamed to say, you won’t find Spudman via Google.
     
    But if you go to Wikipedia you will find a fairly recent article referencing Dr. V. as the father of Six Sigma, complexity, ancient mathematics and all things Operations Research and Markovian.
     
    But if I HAD come from a long line of Spudkowski’s they’d certainly have been great intellects and warriors – and there’d have been no generational genetic trait skipping!!! 
     Spudkowski

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    #147228

    Darth
    Participant

    Vinny you sly fox.  You were as transparent as Phil and I enjoyed the entire thread.

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    #147229

    BB
    Participant

    Can’t anybody explain to this poor fellow what Harry’s accomplishments are supposed to be ?  Frankly I can’t think of any right now … maybe if I wait for a million years …

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    #147238

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    tHANK  yOU

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    #147239

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    Agree  fully.Let  the  green  colour becomes  more  Greener??

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    #147245

    Theo:
    I forgot to mention the multi-normal distribution, and it’s taken me some time to take a look at Anom.
    Please bear in mind I only consider myself a practitioner. I’m not an academic, statistician, or ‘leader.’
    As a pratitioner I take many liberties and sometimes I have to develop my own ‘models.’ After all .. everything is a model – even reasoning – and we’re not really sure whether it represents reality of not. Take death for example, we’re all aware of it – but according to some, death might not mean a person is actualy dead!
    Imagine for a moment we’ve take several thickness measurements across a plate. Not at random because we’ve no justification in assuming the data is homogeneous, or independent. (This is like blocking a p-chart into the days of the week! I suspect you’re familiar with this approach :-)
    Sometimes, processes exhibit ‘stratification’ and each area on the plate will exhibit different means and possibly variance, even though each sub-distribution is normal. I call this a multi-normal distribution. When a plate is made slightly thicker – all the sub-distributions move together, which indicates dependence. As you know these characteristics are problematic for univariate statistical procedures.
    This type of process does not seem to satisfy the requirements of Anova, and or Anom. Please correct me if I’m mistaken.
    Once of the advntages of the Motorola Multi-vari chart – since adopted by Shainin – is the use of Shewart’s metro-glyphs. Originally, Shainin only used blocking, but did not code each measurement point, as our chart clearly did in 1987.
    This approach had a drammic effect in wafer fabs., notably MOS 3 because previously, people only used X-bar and R charts, which are fine for finding sources of variation, as long as one is prepared to re-plot them with a variety of subgroup constructions. Before the advent of PCs, this wasn’t even an option, because we were too busy trying to solve technical problems, such as passivation hole, etc.
    Since a Mulit-vari chart can indicate this sources of patterns or graininess effectively using the pattern recognition capability of the ey/brain, we prefered them. We could just look and the pattern of variation and understand the process, but their power lost on the ‘uneducated eye.’
    The chart even had a test of proportions for each metro-glyph and various other tests to highlight non-random behaviour, and dependence.
    I’ll give an example. In the 80’s many furnace operations around the world consisted of a $50,000 furnace and a 50c spike thermo-coupler holder – a piece of bent metal.
    Many processes had been ‘transported’ from Universities using older equipment and smaller wafers and tubes. The implication was manufacturing processes had a low atmsopheric pressure at the load end of the furnace, near the scavenger box. This condition is immediately recognisable on a Multi-vari chart.
    Furtehr, a number of sources of variation adn conditions can be found on Multi-vari charts, which were never seen on X-bar and R charts. For example, one could detect homoscedasticity – for example at the load end, particularly when gases hadn’t been scaled in terms of volumetric rate – usually the case. Also, covariance between all the measurements which made X-bar and R control limits too tight.
    By the way, Minitab’s Multi-vari uses Anova, which to my mind is incorrect.
    Later, when the IBM PC became available in MOS 3 – in about 1986, Mike Wolfe wrote a complete suit of programs using Microsoft’s Basic. (The only reason we used IBM to control the manfucture of Intel microprocessors is because no one could program a Macintosh – even if you had good documentation! Not much seems to have changed :-)
    While nearly all processes engineers supported this approach many quality professionals objected, even after achieving great imporvements and record yields.
    In 1988 I attended a Motorla Quality Council meeting in Phoenix, and I presented simulations of all these sources of variation and conditions comparing X-bar and R charts with Multi-vari charts. (This was when we were told to put 6s on our Powerpoint slides – I still have them!)
    Dr. Harry attended the meeting, which was the only time I met him. Imagine my suprised when years later I had to attend ‘Blackbelt’ training fifteeen years later and found all the ‘univariate’ assumptions had returned. Moreover, little represented what we knew and practiced as Six Sigma!
    In my opinion, we all should move on to TPS, which also includes ‘process excellence,’ and no longer speak of Six Sigma because as the other poster correctly states, Six Sigma will always be linked with a ‘trainer.’

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    #147246

    Assumptions, assumptions
    Participant

    A great many know his name but I’d be willing to bet you live in the disillusioned anonymity of more than just this forum … assumptions, assumptions, assumptions, does this great intellect ever go beyond assumptions?
     
    And yes, I do come from a long and proud line of Spudbowski’s, great intellects and warriors all … a true leader in the armies of intellectual peasants :-).  
     
     

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    #147247

    Mikel
    Member

    “And yes, I do come from a long and proud line of Spudbowski’s, great intellects and warriors all.”
    How many generations ago did the inbreeding kick in? Are you one of the tiger people from the Southeastern part of SC?

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    #147248

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Andy,
    Sorry for the delay but last night was the finals of Dancing With the Stars and I had to make my phone calls for Emmitt.
    Most of them were probably were top guys but it wasn’t were I wanted to be. The up side was it was difficult to get shot when your radar hut is buried under sandbags – it also helped that nobody was shooting at us – but if they would have been the sandbags would have been great.
    Regards

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    #147249

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    Bro,
    Pukes??? You have heard “Party with the Arty” for us it was “Swing with the Wing”
    Regards

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    #147250

    Mikel
    Member

    Agreed, that is why Cpm is a better metric than Cp, Cpk, Pp, and Ppk.
    The teaching of SPC needs to be altered from putting the centerline at x-bar. The centerline needs to be target.
    We also need to alter the rules for starting a process. The rules recommended by the old QS9000 on page 101 (sorry I don’t remember the page is TS) with the altered rules for placing of the centerline will dramatically change how we think about processes.
    BTW – this is how I teach Six Sigma and always have.

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    #147252

    Mikel
    Member

    Harry’s accomplishments –
    1) one hell of a self-promoter; always done while taking credit for others work.
    2) has ability to spin the likes of Larry Bossidy and Jack Welch on his finger for a short period of time (but long enough to get that contract!) and by doing so has made loads of money. Also has the knack of having enough people willing to cover his butt that many of his contracts have had good results despite the fact he did not participate and the fact that his “intellectual property” is never used.
    3) travels with an entourage ala a “rock star”. Facilitates his consumption of money therefore the need for “Black Belt in a box” and a return to SSA (temporarily – they will tire of the act again quickly).
    4) ability to alienate 99%+ of the people who have made him successful. Reigle, of course, is the outlier.

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    #147253

    Mikel
    Member

    Wow, the mother of Six Sigma must be Anna Nicole Smith with two boys fighting for paternity. Must be why Harry talks about the mother lode so often – an obtuse reference to Anna Nicole’s well endowed brexxs.

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    #147258

    GB
    Participant

    It was just a joke…As i said, I’m happy to find Brothers in arms on this site.
    ;-)

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    #147263

    Lebowski
    Participant

    The Dude: This is the xxxxx guy! I can find this xxxxxx Lebowski guy! Donny: His name’s Lebowski? That’s your name, Dude!

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    #147265

    Lebowski
    Participant

    I’m sure that warrior skill set is pretty handy these days.
    Friday November 17 8pm Showtime
    Lebowski

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    #147266

    Lebowski
    Participant

    I thought I recognized you from my movie.
    Malibu Police Chief: Mr. Treehorn draws a lot of water in this town. You don’t draw sxxt, Lebowski. Now we got a nice, quiet little beach community here, and I aim to keep it nice and quiet. So let me make something plain. I don’t like you sucking around, bothering our citizens, Lebowski. I don’t like your jerk-off name. I don’t like your jerk-off face. I don’t like your jerk-off behavior, and I don’t like you, jerk-off. Do I make myself clear? The Dude: [after a pause] I’m sorry, I wasn’t listening.
     
    This Friday 8pm Showtime
     
    Lebowski

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    #147267

    sqe
    Member

    It’s a new day – and “new sxxt has come to light!”

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    #147268

    Lebowski
    Participant

    That is an interesting point in number 2. The infamous Bossidy connection. His buddy Schroeder wasn’t even on Bossidy’s staff. He was on Cerk’s staff.
    Any idea who actually signed that Allied Signal contract?
    Alienation may be difficult to quantify. Litigation is unambiguous. Since there are people such as Spud and Marlon Brando bought into the Harry ethos lets do a Chi square test between the real Quality gurus and the aspiring Quality guru. That would be the number of people thay have had on staff and the number of people from their staff they have been involved in litigation with. I’m guessing we are rejecting the null.
    Lebowski

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    #147269

    Lebowski
    Participant

    This is way to easy.
    Donny: What? Walter Sobchak: Were you listening to The Dude’s story? Donny: I was bowling. Walter Sobchak: So you have no frame of reference here, Donny. You’re like a child who wanders into the middle of a movie and wants to know… The Dude: (interrupting) Walter, Walter, what’s the point, man? Walter Sobchak: There’s no reason – here’s my point, dude, there’s no *!$#** reason why these two… Donny: Yeah, Walter, what’s your point?
     
    Lebowski

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    #147271

    Lebowski
    Participant

    I understand your point at least in theory and to some limited extent in practice. BB found the specification base as distasteful. Once A target is set it becomes by definition a specification. The idea of minimizing the variation means what? Let’s put that in the hands of some of these guys with 30 years of experience and they frequently tell you it is the best it will ever be. Is that minimized?
    Specification such as an upper and lower specification should be a boundary based on something such as function, customer sensitivity, etc. This is a naive since most are traditional but lets assume that they mean something. The idea of setting a target and doing nothing more than minimizing variation does not seem like a sound strategy. There will be hundreds of people like BB sounding like Rainman buying underwear at KMart. The entire scenario needs to occur in within some defined parameters.
    That creates the same issue with your proposed strategy. If the centerline is set at the target and the process is operating at another location that means the process is out of control constantly? The strategy could become to use the Control Chart to drive towards the target but the control chart really won’t help you do that. It is like an accountant who tells you you are over budget. That is fine but what tools will get me into control? What methodology will allow me to identify the viables that control the mean and cause it to shift to the location of the target?
    That creates the next question. How do I establish the target? A DOE would most likely be a good response. Does that mean I go straight to DOE with a huge number of variables and unqualified measurement systems? Let’s qualify those measurement systems and use a couple of hypothesis tests to eliminate some of those variables. This is starting to sound like DMAIC. I am not trying to sound like a nihilist with regard to the Cpt methodology. There is no reason to regect one method over a word such as specification and choose something as ambiguous as minimize variation. If BB feels better with a target, select a target for the mean and divide the specification width by 12, don’t tell him where the number came from, and give him a target for the standard deviation. Now he will have two targets and should be twice as happy.
    You appear to have given this some thought. My issue was with the silo thinking that BB was proposing. The process of improving a process is just that the process. Do I need to change my methodology to get me where I am going? It is a methodology and the name doesn’t matter much.
    Lebowski

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    #147272

    Lebowski’s nemesis
    Participant

    Actually had you not assumed the persona of one of my favorite characters in one of my favorite movies, I’d have been able to resist poking at you a bit.    Much like the fine Oriental rug that was Lebowski’s nemesis in the movie, your rug will be pulled out from under you Friday at 8:00PM (and that’s CST b’wipe).
     
    And none of that Great Debate bobbing and weaving rope-a-dope “I’m not really going to be there because you won’t really be there” stuff that went on for well over a year between the 4-Stans, Harry, Reigle and maybe Schroeder.    I had hundreds of tie-dyed t-shirts, thousands of mock animal cranial adornments (with time sensitive expiry dating for adhesives), and dozens of mismatched tire-tread sandals left over that I couldn’t sell – even to the potheads around Berkeley, the cost of which I had to absorb into several GiMedProd R&D budgets. 
     
    I’ll expect your whitepaper no later than Thursday at 3:00PM (again CST b’wipe) or you forfeit the showdown.   Meantime I’ll look around on Google or Wikipedia for a whitepaper of my own to send you.  
     
    So dude, I accept, sneeze on, wad and throw back your lame much-too-small gauntlet.   

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    #147273

    Lebowski
    Participant

    I did that search. It appears that he has said it often enough that some have believed it and that appears to mave made it appropriate for him to refer to himself as the father of Six Sigma on his site. Motorola’s site still gives credit to Bill Smith.
    There was the reference to Harry being the godfather of Six Sigma. I would assume that would excite Marlon Brando since can now be a gangster and quality guru. The new Boardroom tactic becomes sign the contract or I’ll put your brains all over it. I am sure that persona appeals to Harry.
    So now we have a father, a godfather, Stan mentioned a mother, and if we look up Phil Crosby to keep reality happy we have the fun uncle or something like that. This is getting to be like one of those family trees with no branches. 
    Obviously there is the question about who has what legitimate right to what moniker. If we step back as Correction recently did and ask ourselves why is this title of father of Six Sigma so important to Harry when it is so clearly the legitimate claim of Bill Smith? That leads to the next question if someone is willing to claim something as theirs when the true identity is such common knowledge what does that indicate about the person making the false claim? That leads to the question should I do business with this person or does that type of motivation and behavior extend beyond the self promotion?
    Lebowski

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    #147274

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Nobody assumed any ones identity. Lebowski is a lifestyle.
     
    You seem testy today. The movie has more of a cult following than welcome back Kotter ever had.
     
    Brandt: You never went to college… The Dude: Oh, no I did, but I spent most of my time occupying various administration buildings… smoking a lot of Thai stick… breaking into the ROTC… and bowling. To tell you the truth Brandt, I don’t remember most of it.
     
    WTF is a white paper? I must have slept through that class. Maybe we were in occupying the student union building. I can’t remember.
     
    I can’t make it. I am bowling at that time.
     
    Lebowski

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    #147275

    Howling Owl
    Participant

    Wealth, riches, success, and reputation only pose one problem .. the fear of losing it.

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    #147278

    Mikel
    Member

    Or perhaps the reality of already losing most of it.

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    #147279

    Lebowski’s alter ego
    Participant

    Oh yeah????  Well I’ll be bowling then too!! – and bowling REAL well because of a hereditary lineage of great bowling-shirt wearing, beer drinking, belching intellects and warriors.        
     
    Besides, Lebowski is MY lifestyle…… MY hero…… MY mentor…… MY moral compass – and it’s just not right that you try to step in and parade around as the Big Lebowski.  
     
    Who’s got the Hawaiian shirts, ponytail, kaki shorts, crappy car, and sodden attitude?  Hunh, you or me??   Well actually I dress well, kiss-axx and drive a new 7-series BMW, but you get my point about a MORAL compass – that’s the main thing here.   
     
    And no, I’m not testy, just trying to offer a perspective in this vast wasteland of Six Sigma anonymity.  
     
    Nice to chat with you again – I always enjoy it.  V.

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    #147280

    Lebowski
    Participant

    You need to include rugs. You may also include toes if you are attempting to feign a kidnapping.
    This is purely a hypothetical question. Let’s assume you believe that is the answer. Do you do business with that person?
    This is akin to a manufacturing issue. People claim quality is an issue and it is not. 100% good is obviously not an issue. 100% bad is not an issue because you know it is all bad. The problem when you know you produce both good and bad. Mixed quality is the issue. Your customers satisfaction is now in the hands of whatever measurement system you use to sort the good from the bad.
    Lebowski

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    #147281

    Howling Owl
    Participant

    Bad investments huh .. internet bubble, Enron, etc.

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    #147282

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Lebowski as a lifestyle, hero, mentor and moral compass is like Intellectual property laid before Harry. It assumed to be the property of everyone or at least until he pick it up.
    I like the sounds of the well dressed, kiss-axx, Beamer driving person but that does seem to take a lot of energy and that jepordizes my bowling average.
    I appreciate your right to a perspective. Just as time redeemed Deming from his original foray into US manufacturing we will see Harry occupy an appropriate spot next to the funny uncle. Crosby will never be viewed in the same light as Deming, Juran, Fiegenbaum, etc. because he was only relevant in a post WW II/post Korean Conflict economy where money flowed like water and even management teams such as those of Montgomery Wards could make money. Harry was not the inovator Bill Smith was the innovator. Bob Galvin was the enabler. Harry filled in a void with known tools. There is no innovation or vision in that. Harry is a salesman and how difficult is that when you are selling to your cofounder.
    It is always a challenge to see you here head to head. What happened to your buddy Darth. He appears to have become a little domesticated. He probably even puts the seat on the toilet down these days.
    Friday 8pm
    Lebowski

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    #147284

    Lebowski
    Participant

    It is the expense of creating an image particularly when the person begins to believe their own story i.e. buying roping horses, saddles, ranchette, etc. The option is to let your image be who you actually are.
    That starts us down that list of questions again. Why would someone create an image that isn’t actually who they are? This is like applying the 5Whys to get to root cause. When you arrive then it is time to gaze at the as of yet undefined achievements and judge their validity and value and make decisions about who this person is and do I want to do business with them.
    Lebowski
     

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    #147287

    Darth
    Participant

    The seat goes down but then I just pee on it anyway assuming it even reaches that far.  Fact is that I have actually had to work hard lately much to my distaste and dismay.  But, I have followed the thread but haven’t had time to reply to the many clever quiips and discussions.  Phil and Vinny have done a great job dragging this on.  Has anyone counted the number of responses yet to see if this thread borders on some kind of record before the Evil Webbie discontinues it?

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    #147288

    Darth
    Participant

    To add to the mix, don’t forget Bill Smith’s step-daughter.  She is a Babe of a Step Daughter and you know I am an expert on Babes.  She is very attractive, bright, knowledgeable….all the qualities of a business associate but not material for a wife, girlfriend or mistress. 

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    #147289

    Mikel
    Member

    limos for the entourage…..

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    #147291

    Mikel
    Member

    The babe acid test – did you think Reigle was attractive when appearing as his daughter?

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    #147292

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Atlanta doesn’t have the bowling centers to attract a Lebowski.
    Is there a spec on the length of strings? It is a Six Sigma site so I guess there must be. Lets keep BB happy.
    Lebowski

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    #147293

    Lebowski
    Participant

    The tree just got taller but there are still no branches.
    Lebowski

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    #147296

    mand
    Member

    Bash Me Too,
    You are correct, Dr Wheeler is a world class statistician. You have probably found his text such as “Advanced Topics in SPC” a bit sophisticated for you.  However you will learn a great deal, even from texts like this, if you take the time.
    Fortunately Dr Wheeler also has much simpler texts for less skilled readers like you.  For example, “Normality and the Process Behaviour Chart” should be essential reading for every green belt. 
    Books like these allow the reader to throw away much of the six sigma nonsense.

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    #147301

    OW
    Participant

    Welcome to the Eternal Flame
    Come on in and call someone a name.
    There’s no price for not acting nice
    The stage is set to vent your rage
    Suddenly your heart is pounding
    You really don’t have to act your age.
     
    So if you want to malign
    Step right up and join the line
    Here’s wishing this thread would go away
     
    From Styx and Stones
     
    :-(   Old and Weary

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    #147306

    Mike Carnell
    Participant

    HBGB,
    I am sorry that response must have sounded harsh.
    Regards,
    Mike

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    #147313

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    To  settle  this  debate  piecefully I  suggest to  make  a  new  Movie:
    Godfather Part 4 ,Main  characters  should  be  given  to you and  to Mikel Harry.In this  movie  I will  not  act  I  will do  the  Scenario.Stan will  carry  out the  “Direction”.Please  let  me  know  if  you  agree ?

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    #147317

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    It  is  a  historical  fact,stated  by  the  Juran??

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    #147318

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    Ignorance  is  colorless  like  water.This  why  I’m  invisible?This  also an  advantage of  being  Ignorant,it  becomes  a  unique status,specially  when  this  forum is  full  with experts  and  pretenders? 

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    #147330

    Lebowski
    Participant

    An earlier post stated that it canme from some nonpeer reviewed magazine not Juran. This is why I have no interest in your Powerpoint slides. You have no idea what you are speaking about.
    Lebowski

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    #147331

    Lebowski
    Participant

    You are very much like a talking bobble head doll with the exception that there may be more original thought from the doll.
    You seem to think that kissing butt for the Harry camp will get you forgiveness for your six shooters and you will be invited to sit the boys around the campfire. It won’t happen. Try being your own person.
    Lebowski

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    #147332

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Lebowski is already has a cult following on film and two of them post here.
    Not even Bollywood has done anything cheesy enough to allow you to participate.
    Lebowski

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    #147333

    Marlon’s Fatigued Buddy
    Participant

    But Marlon (my I call you Marlon or would you prefer Mr. Brando?), and I don’t want to try to speak for the entire forum – as if someone really could speak for this heterogeneous mixed litter of mutts, I believe the point is that you’ve already well established yourself as being ignorant – we fully accept your operating premise.
     
    There is no need to attempt to reestablish your ignorance by trying to post multiple times a day.  It’s a given, we/I fully accept it.  And you are correct in that in as diverse a forum population as we have, you do have a unique outlier position robust enough to even defy standard statistical tools such as the Dixon outlier reduction methodology.    
     
    All I can say is that if you desire to show not only ignorance, but relentless and dogged pursuit of inclusion as well as being an inverse barometer of prevailing thought – well done Sir, you have achieved your goal and there are not many among us who can say that of our goals.
     
    Again, well done Sir and it’s always a pleasure to partner with you in the occasional arm-in-arm walk against the currents of both conventional wisdom and logic.  
     
    But I must say that after one of these tiring cross current dashes I fatigue and become content to just float and flow along with the current but you like the ever-present Energizer Bunny just keep coming… it’s as remarkable and unstoppable as one of those Pacific Coast highway mudslides that ate my home near Half Moon Bay, about a year after I sold it.   

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    #147334

    Count
    Participant

    This post makes 173

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    #147336

    Darth
    Participant

    Dr. Vinny, by now you have discovered that Dr. Barry by the Bench on the Bay has gone out of town.  I hope he left an alternative source for your meds.  Sounds like you need them with our friend Marlon.  Dr. Barry has safely arrived here in S. FL where he and I will be attending our 40th Old Fart High School Reunion.  Why am I attending????  It’s local and I am curious as to what the old, bald, fat athletes look like as well as the droopy titted plastic surgery laden former cheerleaders are up to. 
    Just glad the mudslide took out the house after you sold it and not before.

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    #147338

    Marlon’s Tabloid Partner
    Participant

    Please have Dr. Barry give me a buzz as soon as possible – and I do mean give me a buzz as soon as possible.   
     
    I find the occasional cross-current dashes with Marlon quite freeing of the earthly constraints of logic, oddly exhilarating yet somewhat fatiguing.    While it’s not exactly baiting the forum populace it’s great to see the comments, emotions and flaming rhetoric drawn out.   
     
    I’ve always wanted to write for the tabloids, and not the celebrity watching ones, the Cheerios eating three-legged Martians that live in the wooden leg of Newt Gingrich tabloids – and occasionally partnering with Marlon in forum commentary is about as close as I’ve been able to come to being a tabloid reporter, so far anyway.   
     
    If this bio-medical scientific life-sustaining expensive advanced medical device stuff doesn’t work out Marlon and I might team up on a tabloid start-up.
     
    Yep, regarding the house and the mudslide, like my neighbors used to say, “Life’s a beach” and sometimes more so quite unexpectedly.   
     
    Have fun at the Reunion, and don’t discount (by more than 30% anyway) droopy former cheerleaders.

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    #147342

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    NO .MY PP Slides are  about  Change  Management.The  offer  is  strill  valid?? 

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    #147353

    Mikel
    Member

    Schroeder, Donny out of EMS tried and almost suceeded to get him fired for it.
    Definitely rejecting the null.
    How did you know to call it Cpt?

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    #147363

    Cynic
    Participant

    Sam and “Stan”,
    do you have anything of substance to say?

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    #147364

    Mikel
    Member

    Not to you.

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    #147370

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Schroeder signs the Six Sigma Academy contract and later becomes the cofounder  and President of Six Sigma Academy? Does that chronology seem odd to you? If you sign a contract with someone doesn’t that mean that they already exist? If you were the cofounder that means you were part of something coming into existence. It may have been breech birth but that hardly matters. That sure sounds like someone signed a contract with their own company.
    Cpt is an old habit. It was always Cpt until Minitab decided to play Wheel of Fortune and have Vanna turn over an m rather than a t.
    Lebowski

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    #147374

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Since there is a question mark after the word valid I assume you think, and that is a big assumption, I made an offer. I have made you no offer so it must not be valid.
    If this is about your offer to give me the PP slides then that would be a statement and that sentence does not end with a question mark.
    Lebowski

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    #147375

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Half Moon Bay! Some of the best big wave riding in the world.
    Surfs up dude!
    Showtime 8pm tonight. Be there or be square.
    Lebowski 

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    #147377

    Mikel
    Member

    The slides come with a threat that if you don’t respond that it will be taken as disrespect. Pretty cool.

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    #147378

    Mikel
    Member

    I also know it as Cpt – not many do.
    The Cpm actually came from a 1989 paper in the Journal of Quality Technology. It was given to Carol at Minitab in 1995.

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    #147379

    Mikel
    Member

    From “We are the boys from old Florida” (sung between 3rd and 4th quarters at games in the Swamp)
    ….where the girls are the fairest and boys are the squarest …
    I am already square.

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    #147382

    Marlon Brando
    Participant

    In  Brief:
    Do  you  want  a  copy?Yes or No?

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    #147384

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Mr. Owl your statement has had me thinking for a couple of days about motivation. We have seen Reigle appear under various names over the last couple years almost instantaneously appear whenever Harry is disparaged. Reigle’s most common response is to bash what he calls a basher basically lobbying to have any remark that doesn’t heap accolades on Harry to be classified as illegal, unprofessional, unethical, or unnatural. Beyond that Reigle will usually make remarks about the poster being from the -3 sigma end of the spectrum and the people who spend time on the Forum are losers.
    Let’slook a little closer as Correction did earlier. To have that instantaneous appearance by Reigle must mean that he spends most of his day monitoring the Forum. An entire headcount, regardless how empty the head, dedicated to monitoring a forum for losers? That wouldn’t make sense if it was actually a watering hole for losers. I screams that the Harry camp sees value in the site. Perhaps because it draws hundreds of thousands of visitors per month and is as close to the epicenter for Six Sigma as there is? The other question is why respond to what the continue to label as losers? Perhaps there is truth in what people like Stan are saying? If you can’t control the censorship on the site, even though Reigle throws in the occasional snipit about the monitors, then the only strategy left has to be to impeach the posters credibility.
    That creates a couple more questions. The first would be since this website provided a personal forum for Harry why would he create his own and put it in the hands of a mental midget like Reigle? The Reigle question is easy. He has been taught to heel perfectly over the last couple decades. The forum issue is much different. Why walk away from a personalized forum with this much traffic? Do you have any idea what it takes to create the traffic that this site has? Can anyone be such a complete control freak or have such a checkered past that they will go to the expense to create an alternate site run by a puppet?
    The second question has to be what drives this behavior that insists on such complete hero worship?
    Once you have asked those questions you have to return to the question is this a person I want to do business with? Regardless of what anyone believes this entire saber rattling and image spinning is all about business. Reigle likes to portray anyone who does not imbibe the Harry ethos as a person trying to be a big fish in a small pond. The real issue is that Harry’s behavior has cost him a place in any pond at all, except maybe India, and at this point in his carrer he seems to be willing to surround himself with the likes of Marlon Brando and Reigle.
    Harry had his 15 minutes and rather than bask in the sun and be appreciative he chose to be arogant and worse he laid claim to the work of others. He is reaping what he has sown.
    Lebowski.

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    #147385

    Lebowski
    Participant

    The level of respect is most likely commensurate with the level earned. Perhaps his hero, Harry can explain that to him.
    Lebowski

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    #147386

    Lebowski
    Participant

    One JQT article and we have Cpm for life.
    Carol seems much more content these days.
    Lebowski

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    #147392

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Florida. Redneck Riviera. Pretty well covers it.
    Does Mr. Wonderful still run the non smoking bowling centers there? The WWF’s contribution to culture. The great part is that neither Reigle or Harry will show up. The Six Sigma version of the Banger Sisters won’t show up if they can’t smoke.
    Lebowski

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    #147393

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Uh, I’m running out of space on my hard drive and I can’t remember what I did with my memory stick. I’ll have to pass at this time. Thank you so much for the generous offer.
    Do you suppose I saved hurting his feelings that I have no interest in his slides.
    Lebowski

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    #147398

    Surfspudski
    Member

    You are indeed the Big Kahuna, Lebowski.     Wax up dude, dawn patrol at the impact zone (and Quicksilver boards and wetsuits line up first!).
     
    Speaking of Big Kahuna, Tarintino’s Pulp Fiction as well as his Kill Bill series are worthy entries into the forum’s notable movies vault along with The Big Lebowski.  
     
    The missus says I can’t watch The Big Lebowski again tonight – something about her birthday, I’m not sure what the entire message was, as it was a bit garbled.   But she did say, or at least strongly imply, that I’ll have absolutely nothing to do from 11:00PM – 7AM, so maybe I can TeVo it and watch it later. 
     
    Surfspudski

    0
    #147400

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Do we get to hang with Flea, Skindog and Condor? Bitchen. Totally awesome dude.
    Both movies are noeable and should be be entered in to the vault. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang has potential but has not stood the test of time. We do need to keep an eye on it.
    Home at 7am! In the words of Kid Rock “You said to be home early.” Oysters for lunch and bear down (not the animal).
    Lebowski

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    #147401

    Darth
    Participant

    Hey Lebo,
    I always jump to Stan’s defense when he is bashed because he is my hero.  Glad no one slams me for that.  Ok, being honest….a trait usually not attributed to Vader….I try to stay on his good side so his Babe of a Sister-in-Law will continue to send me pics of her modeling her latest VS attire.  Almost time for the Xmas shots.  Maybe Reigle has the same motivation for Dr. H.

    0
    #147402

    Surfspudkowski
    Member

    You know what, Marlon?    I’d like to get a copy of your slides.    I’d be very pleased to review them and to offer an objective assessment of content, context, information synthesis, on-target message, delivery, and professionalism.  
     
    While I admit to not being the expert and master of all things management science’ish, I have taught at university level and worked at (reasonably, but alas not at C-level, yet) senior levels in high-tech and medical products Fortune 100-500 corporations – so I believe that I have a good baseline and I’m capable of contribution and objectivity.
     
    Please send your slides to  [email protected]   and give me a few days to review, cogitate and develop some meaningful comments.
     
    We walkers of the lonely path of cross-current logic dashing and defiers of conventional wisdom need to stick together because there are just too many people out there who really know what they are talking about.
     
    Surfspudkowski

    0
    #147403

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Your dedication to Stan was commendable until you disclosed your ulterior motives. That does appear to be your Dark Side coming through.
    Picture Nixon standing there saying I am not a crook while J. Edgar Hoover gazes on from home on his latest VS lingerie. I can see the exact same scenario only with Harry playing Nixon and Reigle plays J. Edgar.
    Perhaps part of Reigle’s struggle is with his exclusion from your discussions concerning SoBe. Perhaps he is spending most of his time in Key West and P Town? Why not the VS undergarments are probably spiffy casual wear for that little sprite in those locations.
    Lebowski

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    #147404

    Lebowski
    Participant

    You appear to be searching for a friend.
    Lebowski

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    #147406

    Howling Owl
    Participant

    Lebowski,
    Of all God’s creatures, the dog is the most loyal.
    Howling Owl

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