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ISO and Six Sigma

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  • #39904

    UFO
    Member

    Does an ISO certified company that actually practices the
    related principles really need six sigma? If so, what can
    the shareholders reasonably expect from six sigma that
    the ISO-based systems are not currently delivering?

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    #122550

    Adam Bowden
    Participant

    Here is my 2c worth….
    If you are ISO certified – good for you – that means that is you procedures state make junk you will repeatedly make junk.  ISO is a Management tool to “control the processes” and people within it.  Lean, Six Sigma, DFSS etc etc are all focussed on change – change to improve processes – this is more Leadership.  If your business is not changing rapidly to meet the needs of your customers, or atleast as quickly as your competitors, you’re doomed.  ISO is OK – but it should be keeping up with change – not restraining it. 
    Six Sigma or whatever you’d like to call it – you need something to transform your processes. ISO will not deliver change – don’t get caught in the death spiral !
    OK – now I’m getting off my soap box – that feels better !
    Regards,
    Adam

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    #122557

    Tierradentro
    Participant

    Totally agree Adam,
    Process maps (or process flow charts) on nice notice boards/office walls etc may be ‘how we want it to be’ to pass ISO standard, but in reality this is not true. Only yesterday an ass. production manager was putting up a process map on a wall (which is funny as we are due an audit in August..for accreditation) i said “looks like a really good flow” he said “yep” i said (only being new to the company since May) “ok, show me the process, we will walk through it” as we did i said “where on the map does it say you do this/that/the other”
    My point is that things can look pretty on paper & get all the beautiful certificates in the world, but in reality – the processes need improving, gaining ISO does not reduce any variation within a process, 6S does!
    (my 2c also)
    John
     
     

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    #122567

    A.S.
    Participant

    ISO certification process was diluted by more no of certification agencies as a part of their marketing strategy.ISO certificate has become an advertisement attraction Hence it is becoming a liability instead ofimproving the bottom.
    In 6S there is No external agency .No audit.No cheating.It will improve our bottom line.
    ISO basic intent is good but it was spoiled by the auditors and certificate agencies.Hence it is no way nearer to 6S now.
     

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    #122577

    Tierradentro
    Participant

    also agreed anbu,
    Worse still (for me) is that the QA manager is retiring soon (he’s old – nice bloke, typical QA scenario, a la different discussion about pushing people into the QA department) & it has been loosely suggested that i will be trying to ‘keep a hold’ of the accreditation (ISO) due in september, fantastic eh?
    yours disgruntled
    John

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