iSixSigma

Racism NOT GOOD!!

Six Sigma – iSixSigma Forums Old Forums General Racism NOT GOOD!!

Viewing 39 posts - 1 through 39 (of 39 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #43147

    Swaggerty
    Participant

    Just read a pretty long thread on here, and i can tell you it wasn’t very pretty at all. Some posters are attempting to use humour to vail their racist tendancies quite openly and others make up fake names.  Darth, twocents and others, you are outragous and should be barred from these fora.  I never knew american people could be so openly bad about this.  I try not to tar the whole nation with this but, to be so racist in public is terrible, makes you think american people get away with this sort of thing on a day to day basis.  Ofcourse it’s easier on an internet site where everyone is annonymous.  Moderators should have been quicker to close the thread down. darth & Two cents, people like you are welcomed at the following link

    0
    #136553

    TwoCents
    Member

    Well, George (if that’s your real name), I will admit that the thread in question did get fairly out of hand.  I can assure you, however, that my contributions (perhaps not the best word) were hardly driven by racial prejudice.  My commentary was strictly driven by the fact that we are repeatedly subjected to posts of the type that was apparently being satirized by the thread originator.
    Regardless of whether you are Indian, American, Australian, black, white, Chinese, or otherwise, posts like “what does Six Sigma mean?” and “is there anybody in my city that trains Six Sigma?” will get blasted.  The reason is that these are silly questions.  Furthermore, they are questions that, with a little bit of research, you could answer for yourself.
    My interpretation of the purpose of this site is to offer an avenue for Six Sigma practicianers to share ideas and get some insight from their peers with regard to issues that they are facing.  It is not, IMO, an opportunity for the overtly lazy to solicite answers to the meaning of life.
    As I mentioned, perhaps certain folks got carried away (incidently, to single out Darth and I was just a bit unfair, IMO.)  If any of my peers were offended by my comments, I apologize.

    0
    #136555

    Ken Feldman
    Participant

    Humor can be a very powerful tool as well as is freedom of speech.  Your response seems in line with what happened in the Middle East as a result of the Danish cartoons.  Assuming that you are not American, I would dare suggest that in your own country there are some quite outrageous caricatures of Americans most of which would be found insulting.  In fact, if you read the entire thread again, you will see that most of the posts were in response to whomever started the Former President of India thread. I would suggest that you lighten up a bit and if you truly care about what is going on in the world you might focus in on some of the comments that are coming out of Iran and Gaza.

    0
    #136556

    TwoCents
    Member

    Behold!  A perfect example in this morning’s threads!
    Warning:  I will generalize a bit to make the point.  I am doing so at risk of once again being called a Klan member.
    Here is an example of a great post by someone who is most likely not an American (please read the disclaimer above):
    How long should a well designed yellow belt training session be, and what training do you include?
    Regards
    Sanita
    Sanita is clearly facing a problem that many of us face…the inconsistency in the standards in terms of length of training.  She is therefore attempting to figure out how to discriminate between programs as she either tries to create training of her own or select a training provider.  This site, IMO, is a great place to try to get some insight to work through a problem like this.
    Next we have Naomi, who I’m going to guess is an American (I may be wrong, but this is what my disclaimer is all about).  She writes:
    Please, Could anyone send me a template for a six sigma report?
    I need that for a job interview!
    Thanks a lot.
    Naomi
    Naomi clearly falls into my “overtly lazy” category.  A template for a Six Sigma report?  Huh?  First of all, we have no idea what she is talking about, because she does not give us enough detail about her situation.  This could lead us to believe that she does not really know what she is asking, which in and of itself, wouldn’t be a big deal.  In most cases, those who use this forum would simply ask her for more detail.  However, the fact that she needs this “real quick” because she is interviewing for a job that obviously requires some Six Sigma resources, further leads us to believe several things.  First, Naomi doesn’t really have what she needs to get this job.  Second, she wants us to provide it for her.  And finally, the kicker, Naomi probably should not have the job she’s interviewing for.
    Picture this situation.  Suppose that you are a doctor and have worked for years to hone your skills in your chosen field.  You are perusing your professional forum and see this post:
    Can someone help me?  I need some work instructions on how to perform heart surgery for a job interview that I have this morning.
    Thanks,
    Some schlub
    What would your response be?  It is this level of frustration that periodically leads to the lashings that occasionally occur, IMO.

    0
    #136558

    Darth’s Friend
    Participant

    Alas, let’s not forget Post #92166.  Darth’s response was measured and appropriate even though it was one of those 2am type of posts.
    I would suggest that you and Darth don’t get all wrapped around the axle on this.  Some folks can be hyper sensitive and lack the ability to laugh at themselves.  All satire is not racism.  Keep up the good work and contributions and let’s move on.
     

    0
    #136560

    Ritz
    Member

    George,
    A couple of digs at someone claiming to be the President of India is hardly racism.  The flood of ignorant posters is downright annoying, and a little humor at their expense is hardly cause for accusations of racism. 
    BTW – How do you know the posters are even American?  By your own words, do you see the irony that your overgeneralization of Americans is “racist” in and of itself?  Take your “thought police” attitude and run along now.
    To paraphrase a pretty decent flick: “Your words may boil my blood but I will defend to the death your right to say them.”  That is the core of the American value of free speech.  Last I checked, the Internet is a pretty good place to experience that.  What you recommend would be the death of that.
    Ritz

    0
    #136562

    TwoCents
    Member

    I take exception to this response on several levels, all of which I won’t get into.
    However, I will say this:  I take this particular topic very seriously.  I practice Six Sigma for a living.  As such, I am seeing an alarming trend.  That trend is that there are lots and lots and lots of people out there who are also “practicing Six Sigma” but really have no idea what they’re talking about.  The fact that this is occurring is dangerous, IMO.
    The more people out there who are in a hurry to get a Black Belt so they can pump up their resume, improve their standing with their colleagues, make more money, etc, the more likely it is that bad Six Sigma will be practiced.  As such, the more likely it is that Six Sigma gets a bad name and people stop believing.  When that happens, I will be out of a job and I will no longer be able to do the work that I love so well.
    If I’m too outspoken about what I see happening on this and other sites, and that makes me a jerk, I can live with that.
    Therefore, when I see posts of the “Naomi variety” – IT PISSES ME OFF!  And, IMO, any reasonably competent Six Sigma practicianer should feel the same way.

    0
    #136566

    Forum Friend
    Participant

    Cents(less),I sense (excuse the pun) that you may have a few frustrations/problems with your life and you are subconsciously channeling them onto this forum which you see as an outlet. Don’t!!!Take a look at yourself from my point of view. I see you as Darth(t)’s sycophant, , or you just suck up in the hope of some reciprocated sycophancy .Could I suggest that you get therapy? Or better still, a life outside of six sigma.Your friend, of the forum kind FF

    0
    #136599

    Swaggerty
    Participant

    Ritz, Darth, 2C et al,
    I think the gist of your responses are that “hey we were only having a laugh, so leave us alone”.  You all know that humour on the internet is a very difficult thing to get over, cultures globally vary greatly and what an american thinks is funny, maybe an indian thinks is insulting.  Very like the Danish cartoon infact as one of you said.  How do i know you are American?  Well one only needs to look at the deplorable use of the English language and grammar to work that out.  Also, FYI i am British, so you can go ahead and classify me now, will be interested to get your take.
    Six Sigma is something different to people in each indepandant organisation, and varys wildly through different cultures and countries (even sometimes within a large global organisation).  What you think is dumb may be perfectly reasonable to someone else.  2C, what threat really is an indian SS practitioner or wannabe to you in your position, to the extent that you insult them at every opportunity….even in your response to my statement you stated questions from people which you percieved to be dumb.

    0
    #136600

    WileeFox
    Member

    Guys,
    Please, please change the record…I have an idea, lets exchange 6S ideas/best practice?

    0
    #136601

    Monk
    Participant

    Hi,
    I have been reading your responses on how you guys are trying to justify your responses, to the information requested by a person.
    Though I would reserve my thoughts on commenting on any particular person, one question that crosses my mind is ..is it the way, the so called experts should react when a novice has asked a stupid question ?. According to me, respect for the six-sigma novices, is the top most priortiy for the people, who say that ‘ six-sigma is their B&B ‘. I am myself engaged in six-sigma activity for a couple of year and I have been part of the forum for several year..but I was astonished with the quality of response by few guys…so I reall doubt the credibility of these experts, who don’t have the basic sense of how to behave in a forum.
    Secondly..If you apply the 80-20 rule, you will see that if holds true here also…80% of the questions asked in this forum are by the people who have only 20% of knowledge about six-sigma. So it should not be a surprise if someone askes a stupid question. Rather we need to politely tell that person to look out for the information. Important thing is we neednot lose our control..just because there are some noise factors making our lives miserable..that shows how deep the six-sigma culture is ingrained into these so-called expert.
    Thirdly.. I strongly beleive that six-sigma is only 30% statistics and 70% soft skills..So it is important that the sic-sigma experts need to demostrate that when they encounter any problem in real life situation also..thats the real test.
    So..my advise to the so-called experts…pl..watch your language..irrespective of  person from any country, creed or caste…just show empathy and then think what the person on the other side will feel about it…..Afterall the six-sigma experts get the bad branding due to impulsive response.
    Take care ,
    Monk.

    0
    #136603

    equinox
    Participant

     
    George,
    Darth was right in his message of 2:23pm  on 19th .. We do have negative opinions of the USA inhabitants. Not Americans, which would be offensive to natives of Peru, Chile, Argentina etc …. Very poor on their geography knowledge, Something similar to their use of the English language … but, with all that has been said … if you abide by the following rule you should avoid any future annoyances …

    ’Never argue with an idiot .. Invariably they will drag you down to their level , and then beat you on experience …’

    It will always end up with ‘My gun is bigger than your gun’ … some people don’t know any other way .. I bet some think that the people in Hiroshima have an attitude problem with the US .. single minded as a result of the force fed media culture … Sorry, did I say culture then ?.. my mistake.
     
    Yours
     
    Karl Philips,  UK

    0
    #136604

    Ritz
    Member

    George,
    Thank you for championing global sensitivity.  God forbid anyone, anywhere, at any time might take something the wrong way.  We could not survive in such a world.
    You classify me as American, with the evidence being grammar.  Interesting hypothesis, but incorrect (and you might want to check your own grammar and spelling first… ). 
    The irony is that you continue to stereotype and “classify” people while speaking of tolerance and sensitivity.  It’s been entertaining, but it is my belief that your double standards are much more dangerous than some of the more…shall we call them “forward” posts?  I only discriminate against stupidity, and I like you Brits in general.  You don’t strike me as stupid, just dangerous.
    Let’s settle this over a pint, shall we?
    Ritz
     

    0
    #136605

    TwoCents
    Member

    George,
    First of all, if you review my posts and responses to others, saying that I “insult them at every opportunity” is an absolute exaggeration.  Despite what this one instance suggests, I am generally amiable and try to be helpful at every opportunity, if I can…or at the very least share my experiences and thoughts.  When it comes to the “dumb posts”, I generally try to ignore them.  However, my intent with my responses to your post was to attempt (although I’m not sure why) to demonstrate why I think there tends to be some frustrated, ranting posters on this forum, and also the indicate that I don’t think (at least in my interpretation) that the attacks are racially motivated.  Like I mentioned, if you look through my contributions in the past, I think that you will find that I am far from frustrated or ranting (the “it pisses me off” thing is the possible exception, but I can assure you that this was strictly an attempt to emphasize the point.)
    I can also assure you that I am all for the spread of Six Sigma knowledge throughout the world.  I think it is a great thing.  However, I also admit that the rapid commercialization and lack of oversight when it comes to certification is a little scary to me.  It is one example of what causes programs like Six Sigma to “flame out”.  I think we are already seeing the signs.  I have read many recent articles in quality journals talking about why Six Sigma is a sham.  My guess would be that those writing these articles either have a poor understanding of the methodology, or have been the “victims” of a poor practicianer.
    All in all, this forum is a diversion for me, so I don’t really care how many rediculous posts there are on it.  But I do think it is a little unreasonable for newcomers to ask questions that really require a 4 hour training session.  They should, IMO, recognize that, despite the fact that most on this forum are willing to help, “starting from scratch” simply isn’t a viable option and an alternate form of “training” is probably required.  Most potential respondents will recognize this fact and just put them on the “ignore list”, but some will flame them.  Maybe, just maybe, someone reads this thread and says to themselves, “hmmm, am I about to ask the right question?  Will I get an answer, or will I get flamed?”
    I doubt it…but maybe. :)
    By the way, one of my best friends is British living here in the States, and he harrasses me all the time about spelling and grammar as well.  He’s an English professor on top of it, so you can just imagine…
    Stuck up Brits. :)

    0
    #136611

    Swaggerty
    Participant

    yep, ok then i’ll have a Cider

    0
    #136612

    Swaggerty
    Participant

    ok, i’ll have a pint of cider from you too

    0
    #136613

    Brent
    Participant

    I, too, have a problem with what I consider “frivolous” posts such as “What is Six Sigma?”.  And I agree that laziness is usually at the root of such posts.  Such behavior is prevalent on several other forums I frequent, and smart a** responses are the norm!!
    I think people should realize what a resource this forum is for practioneers…people such as Darth have forgotten more about Six Sigma than many of us will ever know!!  And others here (as well ) are quick to offer help, especially when a problem is well stated.  These people are giving free advice to there peers, when, in reality, they (or their companies) charge very high hourly rates for such advice!
    So let’s not bash a valuable resource (or cry Racism!) too quickly!
    And George, don’t expect a pint from me…I have no sympathy for your view!!

    0
    #136614

    TwoCents
    Member

    This is totally off topic, but…
    Reminds me of a joke my friend loves to tell:
    Adolph Coors, Eberhard Anheuser, and Arthur Guinness walk into a pub and sit down at the bar.
    The bartender asks Adolph, “What would you like?”
    Adolph responds: “A Coors, of course!”
    The bartender asks Eberhard, “What would you like?”
    He responds, “Why, a Budweiser, of course!”
    The bartender finally asks Arther Guinness, “What would you like?”
    Guinness responds, “I’ll have a Coke.”
    The other two men looked at him, shocked, and say, “Aren’t you going to have a Guinness?”
    Guinness replies, “Well, if you gentlemen aren’t going to have a beer, then I won’t either.”
    :)

    0
    #136615

    Adam L Bowden
    Participant

    like it !!!
    Need to have a little bit more humour on this site other than the usual sarcasm.
    Adam

    0
    #136616

    AJ
    Participant

    All,
         Please remember that this is a professional site and that we are ALL professionals.  Let’s all respect each other and act accordingly.
    -AJ

    0
    #136620

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    Two Cents, Great joke!!!
    Ahhh, the beer of Kings, all hail the mighty Guinness!

    0
    #136623

    Ken Feldman
    Participant

    Sorry, AJ, don’t quite agree.  This is an open Forum with no qualification of credentials, experience or knowledge.  While most of the posters might be considered adults, a large portion would not be considered professionals based on their posts.  That is the core issue which precipitated some of the recent and less tasteful threads.

    0
    #136627

    Adam L Bowden
    Participant

    Now – can you statistically speaking tell the difference between the Guiness brewed in Dublin Vs that from Slough – and which one is exported – so to that end do we really know if we are drinking the the true Dublin stuff or the one from Slough where the water used has, probably same a the London stuff, been “consumed on average 14 times before”.
    well ?
    Adam

    0
    #136629

    TwoCents
    Member

    Well, before I answer, I’d need to know which output characteristic of the product you are asking about.  Likelyhood of making you sick?  Required volume to generate a drunken state?  Weight to volume ratio?  Darkness?  Head size?  Come on!  Give me a Y!
    Taste?  If you want to use this one, then I’d need a documented Attribute Agreement Analysis in order to validate data integrity up front! 
    :)

    0
    #136633

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    The KPIV/KQC are:
    Levels of Peatbog PPM in each draught
    type of bogwater and dirt extruded from the dirty socks soaking in the mash hopper.
    ;-)

    0
    #136635

    Adam L Bowden
    Participant

    Over there there are a few interpretations of the word Bog – one being the peat marsh and another being the Loo/toilet/restroom – thus the comment about the water being consumed 14 times before still stands :-)
    Adam

    0
    #136638

    Ritz
    Member

    Done!

    0
    #136639

    Noble Experiment
    Participant

    It’s 4:20. Everybody chill. We’ll be smooth to achieve our 4.20 sigma levels with hilarious 5Y’s on HT. I can by cleaning out the muda out of the process pipe.

    0
    #136640

    Zero_Cool
    Member

    TC,
    In fact, WE have same sentiment. Unfortunately, this kind of spanking send wrong image on other peers. Who knows, maybe someday, somehow, we will be reporting to Six Sigma (MBB) practioner who doesn’t know how to do a Box Cox transformation.
    Zero_Cool

    0
    #136641

    Vinay
    Member

    I agree with you that posts like “what does Six Sigma mean?” and “is there anybody in my city that trains Six Sigma?” are not some of the very smart questions but keep in mind…no question is a stupid question. If you take this kind of approach, you cannot run a six sigma project. People from other functional areas are going ask stupid questions but that does not mean that we should discourage them to raise their concerns. As a BB or MBB, you should be ready to handle this kind of questions. I have met so many CEOs and Sr.VPs asking some of the most stupid questions.  
    If you do not like this kind of posting, just ignore it. I hope you are from the US and understand very well that in democracy people have rights to say whatever they want, like you have expressed your opinion.   

    0
    #136648

    elephant
    Participant

    Again, in a most convoluted way you have all missed the point.   This has become a living and evolving brouhaha in line with the old story of the blind men describing an elephant, e.g., one grabs a leg and describes the elephant as resembling a tree trunk, another grabs an ear and describes it as resembling a giant fern leaf, etc.    You are all grabbing an appendage and describing it as the whole.   
     
    Issues or concerns expressed regarding perceived laziness and lack of effort were folded in and further picked up as being a response to typical postings from a region and then further determined to stem from bigotry and racial prejudices.  
     
    The way this fired up and divided camps is unfortunately indicative of our remaining cultural divides and/or sensitivities surfacing as we interact and occasionally collide in this seamless global instantaneous communication media, the internet.  
     
    But for the most part it’s really demonstrating the truly wonderful opportunity that collectives of like minded people have (in this case along the lines of Six Sigma) when they can at a grass roots level come together on a common ground usually well beyond what can be accomplished through formal nation state diplomatic channels.   If there is opportunity to really knock down the walls dividing us it’s through open and occasionally dynamically stressed communications like we have recently had.
     
    As a Yank, I do fully support the right to speak and be heard on the part of all, even Darth and the strangely silent Stan.   And I suppose that even must philosophically expand to Mikey, Reigle and the long lost Laxman.   I’m also a strong proponent of stupidity as a common leveling of communication and pseudo-scientific statistically based process quality improvement methodologies and metrics based on elusive 1.5 sigma shifts.   

    0
    #136652

    Stevo
    Member

    Why are you hating on blind people?  Are you saying that they can’t describe something correctly?  Man, it’s this kind of narrow minded people that makes my blood boil.
     
    I’m just “Yank”ing your chain.  Most things said now, someone can find something unPC about it. (it’s kind of fun, makes me feel superior)
     
    Stevo

    0
    #136655

    elephant
    Participant

    Actually, and admittedly said at the risk of inflaming an as of yet untapped but potentially significant isixsigma.com market, it’s all of those blind elephants that really bug me.   All the snorting and rampaging through the marketplace – we just don’t need that.   It puts the entire Elephas maximus genus into question making even the most objective of us think one marauding blind killer elephant represents all elephants.   It just doesn’t.  
     
    Many elephants have very good vision and are respectful of handlers, marketplace vendors and customers, and commerce in general.   So how about it Stevo, let’s just get past all of this, “Oh my god, here comes another blind marauding killer elephant!!!” every time a circus comes to town or the forum.   Thanks in advance for your attention, well thought out and considered responses and love of pachyderms.        

    0
    #136657

    Ken Feldman
    Participant

    Another post in poor taste and insensitivity.  Read the following link and you might understand that what you wrote is tantamount to making fun of 9/11.
    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,138495,00.html

    0
    #136658

    elephant
    Participant

    Another very good point.   I apologize to all offended.  

    0
    #136686

    Agent T.
    Participant

    The water in Guinness comes from the river Liffey which rises in the bogs of the Wicklow mountains. As a child I played at the source of Liffey and used it as a Loo many times. Needless to say I do not like Guinness it is horrible stuff. Later in my life I was involved in purifying the ethanol that went into Guinness at the Dublin plant. The jokes about Guinness coming from the liffey where great because in the 50’s 60’s 70’s the liffey was very dirty and smelled like a toilet. But people still said that Guinness from Dublin was the best.
     
    A pint of the black stuff is the best. Huh
     
     
    Agent T.

    0
    #136688

    Anonymous
    Guest

    Agent T,
    I’m interested in your observation:

    Is that part of their fast brew process?
    Cheers (literally)
    Andy
     

    0
    #136694

    Agent T.
    Participant

    Hi
     
    I don’t know or can’t remember. I supplied activated carbon for ethanol filtration and consulted on carbon column design. My carbon was also used for Vodka filtration.
     
    Regards
     
    Agent T.

    0
    #136695

    Anonymous
    Guest

    Thanks ..

    0
Viewing 39 posts - 1 through 39 (of 39 total)

The forum ‘General’ is closed to new topics and replies.