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Shainin strategies and Six Sigma

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  • #27041

    Ciro Martinez
    Participant

    I am getting a certification as a Six Sigma Green Belt; I already have certifications as Shainin Journeyman; looking forward for getting a Master on Shainin Red X Strategies… but, I have a question…

    What are the differences between..
    Green Belt and Red X Shainin Apprentice?
    Black belt and Red X Journeyman?
    Master Black Belt and Red X Master Shainin?

    Is someone considered more capable than the other?

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    #65775

    Joseph F. Perito, Jr.
    Participant

    Which is best depends on your proficiency in statistics and your ability to organize projects, win cooperation, and effect change. Not refering to your credentials, if you choose to write a book on how to construct a lemonade stand (a first) you can have the bragging rights of being the best in your field without qualification. Shainin was recognized for being a down to earth statistician with superior, simpler, and statistically valid approaches to data analysis and design of experiments. His forte was process improvement through consulting help provided using valid, powerful, statistical analyses. He was not, however, a champion of management reform and standardization of process improvement procedures. Six sigma’s claim to fame is just that… management reform and standardization of improvement procedures coupled with a heavy reliance on statistical methods. Shainen was a master statistician and his methods are not argued to be “weak” or “invalid” or “too theoretical” or “too complicated” by anyone. His methods should be studied, and used. Six sigma has “no” six sigma “black belts” after just four weeks of attending siminars. If you read Breyfogel’s book “Six Sigma: Smarted Soluions Through Statistical Methods” you will realize the extent of the amount of statistics thrown at people in a short peorid of time and come to know that they will not understand it all, nor be able to use it at a level that justifies the title of being a “Black Belt”. In fact, Six Sigma will not work at at all unless there is a complete modification in management behavior and support. This fact is repeated thoughout the books of Mikel Harry and Forrest Breyfogel. They don’t intend to say so, but you will see it repeatededly in the management dictates and management directives that they cite again and again while naming the corporations where the “success” has taken place. One example in the books (that you will find numerous examples of in the books) is the dictate to the management from the president that you will never get a senior position unless you attend the six sixma seminar. The summary of what I’m telling you is that “experience”, “ongoing study”, and your “persistance” in learning and application is what is going to make the best quality engineer. Both Shanin and Six Sigma have something to offer, but neither is “the magic pill”.

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    #65787

    Ben Royal
    Participant

    Mark Twain said someone holding a cat by the tail knows a whole lot more about cats that someone who has only read about them. It is only by using these tools in an environment of management support that you will gain experience and confidence. Expect to make some mistakes and never hesitate to to ask for assistance. You will be pleasantly surprised at how helpful people are.

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    #65790

    Joseph F. Perito, Jr.
    Participant

    Ciro,

    I figured I would strike a nerve. I see where my reply for people to beware if six sigma wolves in sheep clothing has been highlighted with a facination on the word “books”. Since experience (exactly what I was saying) is being touted in the response, I’ll qualify my statement (with my background)that four weeks of seminars produces no six sigma black belts: I hold both a Master’s and Bachelor’s Degrees in Quality Control and Quality Assurance… with three other unrelated Associate’s Degrees. This, I supplement with 35 years experience in nothing but QA/QC work in manufacturing environments….every single work day, QA/QC experience. I have set up SPC, taught it, managed a number of QA/QC departments and have set up and acquired ISO-9002, 9001, and QS-9000 certifications in a number of companies. Many years of work. My college courses in statistics, attending statistics seminars, self study, and use of statistics including and beyond SPC literally exceeds multi-thousands of hours. I do not write books for profit or wait on intermittant work as a quality consultant. Ciro, how’s your simple math reasoning? Calculate this: Why do you think it takes the universities a whole semester to teach one basic statistics course? The formula for turning out “Black Belts” in only four weeks is $$$$$$$$. “Your” $$$$$$$$. I glad to see some readers have Mark Twain in their library. He’s good, but not useful as a project management or statistical reference. Don’t miss one point, I said both Mikel Harry’s and Breyfogel’s books had something good to offer and “should” be read. But they won’t produce any kind of a color for you in a matter of four weeks, except red ink. Ciro, do you make $40,000 a month to pay these people what they want?

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