iSixSigma

which is the most recognised black belt

Six Sigma – iSixSigma Forums Old Forums General which is the most recognised black belt

Viewing 73 posts - 1 through 73 (of 73 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #46373

    six sigma amateur
    Member

    hello friends
    I am very keen to get certified black belt. But i m not able to get clarity on which black belt is most recognised globally or in other terms which carries most value. Is it GE, Motorolla, ASQ,……..?
     

    0
    #153042

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Villanova U.?

    0
    #153043

    Darth
    Participant

    Oh yeah, it’s right up there with the others he mentioned.  If it wasn’t for your constant touting of the program, most of us wouldn’t even know it exists.  Frankly, never met or interviewed anyone who ever got their certification from there. 

    0
    #153045

    Adam
    Participant

    Villanova doesn’t even require a real completed project to get certified.  I think they have some kind of case study you do as your final project.  Be weary of any program that doesn’t require you to complete at least one project as the project lead with significant savings.

    0
    #153050

    Six Sigma Shooter
    Member

    I have and was not impressed.  They did the case study project to get certified – what a waste of money.

    0
    #153058

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Funny Reply?

    0
    #153054

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    It is not  true?They have  an  excellent  simulated  project with 10  assignments and  you  have  to  receive  a  full  credit  for  each  assignment,beside  passing  some  10  Exam. with more than 70%.They  have  four  projects (HC,Manuf.,Finance and  Education),and  you  have to  complete  one   project  before  passing  the  course successfully.The  Eucation Project (for  example)  is  quite complicated and  “Challanging” for many  pretenders?? I  believe that  a  real  BB should  care to  investigate  before presenting  his  opinion??Best  Regards   

    0
    #153061

    BA
    Participant

    In truth, however, I have found that Dr. Harry’s MindPro study program to resonate with our entire team. It’s not only flexible, and convenient, but a very affordable method for Six Sigma knowledge transfer, belt certification, and knowledge retention. BTW, it’s no longer available in DVD, but is available as an online e-learning resource and, best of all, you learn from one of the originators of SS, Dr. Harry himself. No one else can offer you that!
    BA 

    0
    #153069

    BA
    Participant

    And what have you done to improve society? By the way, Sam who??? Now, that’s a lot of crap!
    BA

    0
    #153076

    BA
    Participant

    Sorry, did not get that, Sam who?????????????

    0
    #153108

    Mikel
    Member

    Hi Reigle,MindPro no longer available on DVD? This must be based on its
    overwhelming success!Anyone who has actually seen these or had to try to actually learn
    from the famous doctor would not recommend.

    0
    #153109

    Mikel
    Member

    Dear Complete Idiot,i also have never seen anyone competent out of the Villanova
    program. You reinforce this belief.

    0
    #153118

    Mikel
    Member

    Yes, please pass my comment on. All of these university programs are just about making money. They
    are usually keen for feedback other than checks, p.o.’s, or credit card
    numbers. Maybe they can make a simulated project on this in their
    rigorous simulated project criteria.

    0
    #153114

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Thank You Stan.I  should pass  your  comment  to  them for evaluation?

    0
    #153127

    BA
    Participant

    Stan,
    Everyone on this forum knows that you’re OCD about anything that has to do with Reigle, Harry, university training, etc. Thanks for showing up. Now go smell the Hummus and have a nice day!

    0
    #153154

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    Allthingsidiot, you ar living up to your nom de plume.
    4 simulated projects/case studies  don’t equal 1 real-world project with results.  
    This is not a knock on Villanova, as much as it’s a knock on the 6S industry…”belt-mills” are not the answer.
    This is a perfect case outlining the need for applying the 2E-1M principle…

    0
    #153158

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    BA
    I like  your  answer,straighforward ,hitting the  target,thanks  you.

    0
    #153159

    six sigma amateur
    Member

    thanks for your opinion
    so according to the forum, apart from ASQ, Motorolla & GE the only most recognised black belt certification is Villanova?

    0
    #153161

    Harold Schmurtz
    Participant

    Recognized does not automatically equate to “good”. Villanova is recognized, at least in part, due to the controversy surrounding their use of simulated/pretend projects for certification. The recognition may not translate into the type of professional value that you seek.

    0
    #153162

    qualitycolorado
    Participant

    Six sigma amateur,
    Your original posting has only been out 2 days (since Saturday), and most of that has been weekend time — wait a few more days during the workweek this week and see what else surfaces ….
     
    Best regards,
    QualityColorado

    0
    #153164

    BritW
    Participant

    There are others that have programs, but ASQ, GE and Motorola are the usual names that arise.  Michigan University has one – no opinion on effectiveness, just that they have one. Key is that the trainign is done by someone competent and that a real-time, real-life project is performed.  You can search and find a bunch – George Group, Six Sigma Academy, et al. 
    We had one BB go through Villanova’s.  It was ok, but the simulated projects were fairly useless and the more statistical tools weren’t emphasized as much as some of the other training offered out there.  I made the BB do a project for me/with me before recognizing them internally.   

    0
    #153165

    TAO
    Member

    “Knowledge is power” and you don’t want to give up power, do you?” You’re threatend by what you label as “education mills” and you want control, sorry online training is here to stay, the internet is here to stay, no more borders, and no reason for anyone to subordinate their mind to the influence and control of Heebeegeebees like you!

    0
    #153170

    Mikel
    Member

    No, there is just one hack on here that always pushes Villanova. Look at his language and incorrect use of punctuation to judge his intelligence.
    Look for someone who has their roots in Motorola, AlliedSignal, or early GE – they seem to be the best. My opinion is that the group that came out of Allied in 95 and 96 are the best.

    0
    #153172

    Mikel
    Member

    Reigle,
    I don’t know what OCD is, so you’ve got me on that one.
    The only person who would recommend MindPro is you. Clearly you are not objective and to come on here with the rhetoric of learning from the master himself only works for those that are unaware of what that means.

    0
    #153180

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    gives us the prrrrrrrrrecioussssssssss.
    we wants the precioussssssss…..
    gives us the Villanova certsifications….
    gives us the ASQ certsifications….
    gives us the magic 3-day master Black Belt wunder-certsificationsssssss….
    ahhh, so beautiful, sooo perrrrfect, soooo precioussss…….

    0
    #153171

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    Wow!   I managed to push somebody’s hot button(s)! 
    What vitriol, what hate, what anger!   Very ironic from somebody using the name “TAO”…
    Your cadence and choice words sound just like our old Friend, Marlon Brando, or perhaps Dog SXXt…hmm…
    Sounds like a case of blocked Qi.
     

    0
    #153173

    Mikel
    Member

    Marlon is AllThingsIdiot, so it must be one of the others.

    0
    #153175

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    AlliedAlum here.  Do you remember the secret handshake?  How about the AlliedSignal coat of arms?
    ahh, the good ole’ days.
    On a serious note, The Allied model taken from Mot U. was pretty darn good until AA was engaged.

    0
    #153176

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    Harold, you raise an excellent point!

    0
    #153178

    Good ol’ days
    Participant

    it looks like we’re finally getting the fun of the ‘good ol’ days’ again … smirgol luvs our precious!

    0
    #153184

    Lebowski
    Participant

    That is truely amazing! So how do they simulate the issues with change management? Running team meetings? Working with Process Owners who may or may not support? Sustainability?
    We are supposed to take the Villa Nova Simulated Black Belt with as much credibility as Black Belt who has truely forged their skills in the throws of a deployment? The only thing I can possibly imagine having less credibility is being a digitally certified Black Belt by Dr. Harry and his lap dog Reigle.
    The name change from Marlon to Allthingsidiot at least indicates you have some idea what truth in advertising is.
    Lebowski

    0
    #153190

    Mark Miller
    Participant

    Stan,
    You don’t even own a copy of MindPro, therefore, you’re not qualified to talk about it. You have no facts, your language is full of hate, envy, and jealousy towards Dr. Harry, Reigle, and the rest of the world!
    “Misery is an option and loves company.”
      

    0
    #153200

    Samuel
    Member

    “The  Eucation Project (for  example)  is  quite complicated ..”
    It obviously is complicated for you … I see that it’s even difficult for you to spell correctly … or is this just an example of students who are ignorant enough to do it ?

    0
    #153245

    Lebowski
    Participant

    MM,
    It would seem that the criteria to speak about MindPro is if you had seen it not if you owned it. I don’t own it but I have seen it and it is the same level of junk as Harry captured on his VHS tapes.
    If you believe that someone is jealous of what is on those DVD’s then you obviously have not watched it.
    Lebowski

    0
    #153247

    Mikel
    Member

    I have gone through the entire package, and yes, I do not own it. I would not pay more than the price of a rewritable DVD for it.

    0
    #153251

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    MM,
    Are you just an enthusiastic supporter of MindPro, or do you have a vested financial interest?
    It’s ok to be excited about the offering, as long as you are honest about any affiliation(s).
    -Just curious.
    -Just curious

    0
    #153258

    BA
    Participant

    Mark,
    WOW! The whole cast of “Les Mis” showed up all at one time, including the “Dude” Lebowski.
    On a more serious note, if you’re a MindPro user/owner, what do you like best about it? What changes would you recommend?
    BA

    0
    #153257

    Martínez
    Participant

    Answering to the first original question:
    I received my Black belt certification from air academy and my MBB certification from smartersolutions. personally i would recommend more air academy, I do know others but not as well as these both guys. and more important they do not give you a certification based on a class project… they request a real work project with real daily problems.
    hope this helps

    0
    #153259

    Mikel
    Member

    Reigle,
    You playing these multiple screen names and answering yourself does not fool anyone.
    Do me a favor and pretend to be your daughter again – that one was my favorite.

    0
    #153266

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    You  are  against  Villanova,MindPro..etc,I  suggest:
    STAN’s U. for SS (SUFSS),I  will  be  the  first student  if you  accept  me?best  wishes for  succrss  and  good  luck

    0
    #153265

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Honestly  Ilike  your  comments,it  makes me  laughing,thanks  you?

    0
    #153279

    mid pacer
    Participant

    Mr. allthingsidiotAFTER READING MOST POSTSsimulated flight environment compared to real flight for supersonic aircraft pilotssimulated online shopping to real shoppingsimulated visit to antartica to actual visitsimulated love stories to actual onesimulated video games of today to actual games we played on field in child hoodin simulated environment time is in your control situations are in your controlin real world project you will get calls from wife in between your work , children to take care of,
    and so many other problems
    data collection is such difficult task in actual world training the person who works on process to collect data, make him buy the conceptof process improvement in real world, then getting funds sanctioned from senior management, data not being clean, disturbances from other projects, breakdwon in infrastructure supporting six sigma for one critical day of your projectIF SIMULATED ENVIRONMENT CAN GIVE ALL THIS……
    I AM UP FOR IT…….damn it why you guys want it so easy, everything ready.it can be supplementary experience but never primary
    NEVER

    0
    #153274

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    What  is the  real-world  project?complete  nonsense?If  you  know  how  to  tackle  a  simulated  project  ,using  the  proper   tools,then  what?you  may  be  able  to  solve  any  problem in  the  real  world (using  some  change  management  hints..etc),don’t  make  it  difficult ,you  know  that  the  real-world  projects are less  sopisticated ,but  more  complicated  on  the ” human-side”,so  what ?people  will  not  cooperate unless  you  motivate  them??.I  believe  the  simulated  projects  are  more  challanging in  regard to required  techniques  and  tools.Have already  enough  experience in  both  sides,just  my  opinion.Please  ask  Stan and  he will  agree with  that,I’m  sure????????  

    0
    #153276

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Agree

    0
    #153277

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    What  is  wrong  with  that?I  will  pass  to  you one  case  study for  solving  the  required  assignments?I’m  very  sure that you  would  not  pass the  required score?Let  us  face it  :It  is  only  Jealousy that  is  behind all this  debate.Please  ask  Stan/Darth and  they  would  agree?I’m  sure .best  regards  

    0
    #153282

    Six Sigma Shooter
    Member

    What is wrong with it?  Well, when it came to an actual project and implementing some improvement projects, he was about as clueless as they come.  Didn’t understand why he should get out on the floor, out where the work is.  Just wanteed to sit in the cubicle and play on the computer, doing his data analysis of historical numbers that had very little value.  Didn’t know how to work with process workers as a team member.  Had no idea how to deal with the barriers and resistance one encounters when running a project.  Should I go on?  Go ahead and do your little case study, academic exercises.  The real test is in the real world, where the real problems and real people are, not in some made up world with make believe problems.

    0
    #153278

    mid pacer
    Participant

    Mr. allthingsidiotsimulated flight environment compared to real flight for supersonic aircraft pilotssimulated online shopping to real shoppingsimulated visit to antartica to actual visitsimulated love stories to actual onesimulated video games of today to actual games we played on field in child hoodin simulated environment time is in your control situations are in your controlin real world project you will get calls from wife in between your work , children to take care of,
    and so many other problems
    data collection is such difficult task in actual world training the person who works on process to collect data, make him buy the conceptof process improvement in real world, then getting funds sanctioned from senior management, data not being clean, disturbances from other projects, breakdwon in infrastructure supporting six sigma for one critical day of your projectIF SIMULATED ENVIRONMENT CAN GIVE ALL THIS……
    I AM UP FOR IT…….damn it why you guys want it so easy, everything ready.it can be supplementary experience but never primary
    NEVER

    0
    #153281

    accrington
    Participant

    I personally am the owner of no less than five black belts. I’va also got a brown one, and a nice red, white and blue elasticky one, with one of those S – shaped clasps.
    The black belt that most people recognise is the one with Harley – Davidson buckle on. They often say, “Where’s your motorbike then?”, when they see it.

    0
    #153291

    accrington
    Participant

    In my organisation they use the term ‘MINITAB Jockey’

    0
    #153310

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    WOW…Your Nom de plume is right on…
    No amount, I repeat: NO AMOUNT of simulation can substitute for the cold, hard, gritty realities of an actual project with it’s associated risks, challenges, highs and lows.  NONE.
    Look at the airline Pilot industry..allthough sims are used, it comes down to an actual test flight for certification.
    Look at the Military.  No amount of simultion, Training, or FTX can prepare you physically, mentally, or spiritually for the actual experience of combat…the gore and splatter, the loss of Brothers, the reality.
    I wish you well…seriously 

    0
    #153314

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    I  enjoy  reading  your  comments.
    But  without  simulation nobody  dare  to  fly or  to  fight.Even  nobody  would  introduce  a  new  product  or  service?
    Can  you  imagine a  successful actual  test  flight  without  simulation.
    Simulation is  the  required  training for  successful practical  achievement.After  all  education  or  on-line  training  can’t  offer  you  more  than  that.
    What  do  you  mean by “Nom de plume”?
    Thanks  and  best  regards

    0
    #153321

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    Marlon/Tao/All Things/Dog Sxxt:
    Simulation is fine for training purposes, but when acheiving a certification as a GB/BB/MBB, you are essentially telling the world that you are an experienced, blooded expert in the field of Six Sigma.   I contend that one cannot be considered as an experienced, blooded Leader when all activities prior to cert occurred in a laboratory environment.   The data indicates otherwise.
    “Nom de Plume” is Feench for “Pen Name”…your alias(es).

    0
    #153317

    Adam
    Participant

    Simulation for training, yes. In every class I have taken, we have always done a simple simulation of how to use a tool or whatever the case may be, but CERTIFICATION (meaning you are 100% competant to complete all aspects of being a black belt, there is more to it than the tools) requires a real-world project. If you don’t have a real world project to do, than why are you even getting certified? I call those people certificate whores. They have every certificate you could imagine, yet when it comes down to utilizing what they have learned, they are worthless.

    0
    #153355

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Most recognized has nothing to do with a belt. The top three are Jesus, Elvis and Coca Cola as explained by Kinky Friedman.
    Lebowski

    0
    #153482

    Julius C.
    Participant

    “For lack of training, they lacked knowledge. For lack of knowledge, they lacked confidence. For lack of confidence, the lacked victory.” Julius Caesar
    “Simulation” is where the victory begins.

    0
    #153493

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Silly  comment,everybody knows how  to  spell  that  word,it  is  only due  to  quick  typing.I  thought you  would  like  to introduce  some valuable  comments,but????

    0
    #153494

    Mikel
    Member

    Shouldn’t that be – Excellent Metaphor?

    0
    #153495

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Thank You.Brief  and Wise.Hitting  the  target,closing  the  debate.

    0
    #153492

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Excellent  Metaphor

    0
    #153505

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    I appraciate  your  comments,best  wishes

    0
    #153508

    Mikel
    Member

    Try thinking about his comments.

    0
    #153509

    Lebowski
    Participant

    Thank you. I have been waiting for your permission to proceed and your enjoyment is certainly a priority in my life.
    Lebowski

    0
    #153501

    Airedale
    Participant

    Which is most recognized is debatable, as you can see from the flurry of battling egos here. IMHO, I would recommend a training program that works for you (fits your learning stile) Be sure that you have projects to apply your training as you take it too as the real world is truly better than simulation. That said, simulation is better than nothing. If you work in a manufacturing environment and simulation is part of the program then do a transactional simulation (and visa versa) to round yourself out a little. If certification is part of the program be sure to take the test. However, certification is worthless if you do not use it. I would also recommend that after you have done 3 -5 projects, get the CSSBB primer (it also makes a great reference) study and take the ASQ test. If you have a couple years experience and are recognized by two different organizations as “certified” I would say you are probably competent. In the end, Every project is an opportunity to learn something new or refine what you already know. No one knows it all, not even the prevalent egos battling for supremacy here in response to your original question.

    0
    #153503

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Thank you.That  is  really a  great (objective)  wrapping-up.

    0
    #153504

    Lebowski
    Participant

    I am sure that when Julius wrote that he was thinking “there will be a time when this quote will be extremely useful to rationalize simulation used in Six Sigma training.” Obviously if you understand how he ended up he wasn’t all that good at Change Management.
    Do a little research and see what he used to motivate the troops before a battle. The slaves and prisoners did not simulate a battle, they fought to the death.
    This goes back to the inner drives of a person. The first link in the quote is that confidence is a function of experience. Not true for all personality types. The high A type personality creates that confidence from within self. Add simulation and there may be more but when it is crunch time does the high A believe it will happen because of simulation or himself? They will always go back to confidence in self.
    You may have trouble with that concept. With your exuberant puppy personality you are obviously a low A.
    Lebowski

    0
    #153507

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Lebowski
    Go  ahead ,I  enjoy  reading  your  valuable  sarcastic comments?

    0
    #153536

    Allthingsidiot
    Participant

    Thank  you  for  discovering  all  my  screen names?

    0
    #153559

    BritW
    Participant

    Actually it doesn’t close the debate – it may even prove the point on the other side of the argument.  Simulation is fine for knowledge and learning – the quote ends with an addition – “Simulation is where victory begins”.  Simulation, however, would not emulate victory.  In that case, the Romans and whomever they were conquering at the moment would play a board game and the winner would get the land/resources.As we all are aware (or should be), it is all about results.  You won’t have results without practical projects.  You can’t have actual certification without results.  “Results are where victory ends…”

    0
    #153567

    JCaesar
    Participant

    “Past history is no indication of future performance.” It’s not all about results, but it is about the outcome of the results, as one can have failed results. Even real projects don’t guarantee results, but will only provide lessons learned.
    Consider reading the post by Kiwi, from NZ (looking for online training?). Kiwi is one of many professionals out-there that have “Been There, Done That” (completed real projects), but for whatever reason, don’t have a valid certification (not every organization hands-out certification or has an in-house training facility to do so), therefore, this type of value creation is out-sourced to organizations that will provide such service, which, BTW, is in high demand. “Victory begins with small successes.” Successes that bring desired results in reasonable time!
    People that want to learn and gain knowledge have the right to do so. They don’t need your approval. More importantly, it is their decision to make, their choice to do so, not mine or yours. “Ignorance is not bliss.”

    0
    #153574

    BritW
    Participant

    Once again, I did not confuse knowledge with performance, like it seems you are doing. Results, failed or not, are not acheived via simulation.  Knowledge can be achieved, but application, in my opinion, is even more important than certification.
    I did not indicate that it takes my approval for someone to gain knowledge – I encourage it, believe it or not.  It is my responsibility to hire and develop BBs and GBs.  I will choose to hire ones who have experience over ones with only simulated testing. If I have to hire one with only simulated testing, then I will require an in house project during a probationary period.
    More importantly (to get to your issue with knowledge), I will choose to hire ones with successful experience and no certification over ones with a certifcation and no experience.  So, my pecking order for hiring a BB:
    1.  BB with successful project experience
    2. Successful Six Sigma Leader with no certification
    3. BB with no project experience (i.e. simulated project only)
    I bet you will find other businesses who choose in the same manner.  So, no matter what your argument, it is the customer (employer) who is hiring or providing a raise.  Choose your certification as you wish.
    Certification should mean that you can do.  In my mind that means you have done it.  It is the lessons learned, especially in change management, that separates the certification with no project versus the guided certification with real-time real-project experience.

    0
    #153576

    JC
    Participant

    Brit,
    Once again, yes, if options #1 and #2 are not available, the learner can do #3(Certification and Simulation). Steve Harrison or AI have made this point in another post. Even if the learner has #2, but would like to enhance their knowledge-base they can still do #3(Certification and Simulation). Super! Great! No Problem! 
    Additional suggestion, is for the learner to brush-up on their interviewing skills (to get that job) or negotiating skills (to get that raise). Better yet, if they have #1, they may consider going out on their own!
    BTW, I enjoy your objective posts!

    0
    #153579

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    As Brit said earlier, It’s not about simulation in training…that is a good thing.
    It’s about relying ONLY on simulation “experience” in order to gain certification in a particular field.
    Get it?

    0
    #153598

    Heebeegeebee BB
    Participant

    You are welcome.
    From the ettiquette guide:
    “…Do not post under many screen names in order to support your position. Don’t try to deceive. Do no harm. We track information associated with each post and abuse will not be tolerated…”

    0
Viewing 73 posts - 1 through 73 (of 73 total)

The forum ‘General’ is closed to new topics and replies.